I mean, I think she does more when she's dead than she did when she was alive. Talk about weird!

And I know this isn't exactly related to the topic: but what in the world does that wolf that keeps appearing mean?

Well, feel free to discuss any theories about Advent Children here!

I don't think you can.

Well, Aeris and her Holy rain saved the day, right? Isn't it weird though? Aeris is the heroine of AC, and I haven't watched the movie yet I'm just basing my facts on what I've heard so please don't get mad, but there's one small problem; Aeris is DEAD.

...Whoa, she's like an angel or something. Heehee.

She is like an angel and even more so in AC. Practically elevated to an omniscient Earth Goddess. She comes to help Cloud and give him strength on a number of occasions. I won't say much more for fear of spoiling it but she's awesome. : ) *shameless Aeris fan*

Yes, Aerith helped Cloud move past his guilt and helped him forgive himself. Now he can move on and live his life without guilt.

The reason the line in AC exists is because she didn't fully believe it until that moment.

Advent Children, however, has drastically raised my opinion of her. Instead of being a weak, damsel in distress, Princess character she has evolved into a beautiful example of the tragic heroine. She is motherly but strong and acts as a guide and foil to the hero rather than a tag-on simpily because he needed a love interest.

She is awesome in AC though.. although her english voice wasn't very good..

I just thought they could have done better with most of the voices..

Kingdom Hearts is pretty cute.. I don't see what their roles are... other than being there because they are cool..

Cloris rulez! XD

~Fran

Tifa is cool, but apart from killing baddies that's pretty much all she did, apart from a few other things.

~Fran

She had so much to cope with, being the last Cetra was the cause of so much pain. I mean, her father is shot when she's just a baby, she and her mother were taken and experimented on for most of her childhood. When they escape, her mother dies and she has to live with a complete stranger. For the rest of her time in Midgar, she has to run away from the Turks who are constantly chasing her! She's been through so much strife(ha ha bad pun xD) and yet she smiles and never says a bad word about anyone or anything. Women don't have to be physical fighters to be considered strong!

When she died I was just shocked. She was a great character, one of the best and Square killed her! *shakes fist*

Then in AC despite the fact she's dead, she comes to Cloud and helps him through his pain, she heals the Geostigma, she pushes him back to Earth. She's not the silly little damsel in distress princess alot of people make her out to be!

P.S: Cloud/Aerith forever! xD

Yeah, same here!!

For everyone here, put it this way. Tifa is physically strong while Aeris is mentally and emotionally strong. Simple as that!

SQUENIX!! WHY'D YOU KILL AERIS?!?!?

~Fran

She is mentally strong and emotionally strong too.. while she is more timid than Aerith with expressing herself...

She had the strength to try to help Cloud fix his messed up mind .. twice..

Once in the game.. with his memories ect..

Also a second time.. with the dilly dally crap. Also she is emotionally strong too.. dealing with the death of her father.. ect.. and the destruction of her hometown... ect..

Also it takes a LOT to raise 2 kids, run two businesses and try to help out Cloud.. all the while .. trying to deal with her feelings..

So both girls went through hell and back, and are both strong characters...in all aspects... because.. while Aerith might have been weaker in physical attacks than Tifa.. Aerith healed and was a good magic user..

Soo i'm not sure it is that simple..

They are both great girls..

It is sad that Aerith died, she was one of my favorite characters... but I do see why it was necessary..

I do agree with what you have said, but I still think that her mental/emotional aspect are weaker than her physical strength. I'm not saying she's just muscle, it's just that she needs to improve within to improve others (i.e. "dilly-dally shilly-shally") Elaboration on that later.

~Fran

I agree, no one can be perfect.. and Tifa wouldn't be such a great character if she didn't have her flaws.. then she'd be just.. big boobed mary sue. ... I stand by the fact.. that it is not her fault she is so unrealistically porportioned.. it is the male fan service.. although no one is saying she is a bimbo..

Both girls are tough cookies...

Weeeeell.. i'm not sure it is her fault he went thorough that.. he would have been horribly messed up and confused.. about his past had she straightened it out in the first place.. and Cloud is Cloud.. being mentally unstable is guaranteed with him. Yes, she could have been stronger and told him..

It's great having a friendly intellectual conversation with people! I've been to a few outside forums.. that are just.. "tifa has big boobs.. she is a *insert rude word*" or "aerith is soo fliirty... such a *insert another rude word*".. it bugs me.. because I like both girls..

I think Tifa should have told Cloud the truth about the lifestream, she was his friend after all. However, it's Aerith that takes the first step saying her little "I want to meet you" monologue on the date scene.

Yeah Tifa is strong emotionally too but with the Nibelheim stuff she had Cloud to help her through since he was there and experienced it. Aerith had nobody who could come close to understanding what she went through.

That wasn't a bash at Tifa! It's just, in my opinion, Aerith was that little bit stronger because of her past. And both Aerith and Tifa are equally patient with Cloud in AC. Okay, Aerith didn't have 2 kids to bring up as well but you can tell BOTH girls are trying to help Cloud through in their own way.

I think Aerith's role was a guider for Cloud, protector of the Planet and...maybe a reassuarance to Avalanche that she's still with them.

He drove away his dorky goofy ditzy self.. and became an emo poster boy because he felt guilty/responsible for her death..

Aahh the date.. I was trying to get Yuffie.. XD.. because she said that one was funny... and wouldn't tell me what happened... I got Tifa instead..

Haha and no.. i'm not a cloud/yuffie shipper..

It's completely frustrating.. but understandable, that square isn't going to tell us anything about which girl Cloud loved.. ect..

We know he cares about them..

But a friend has this theory, and it makes sense to me, that while he cares for people... he is emotionally stunted in the love relationship department...

because.. he was in the test tube for five years.. from age.. 16 ..to 21..

Which is truly when guys start to notice girls.. and want relationships..

While i found the childhood crush.. sad but adorable.. i'm not sure he would still carry those feelings.. although when he did return to nibelheim.. he couldn't face anyone (although.. that isn't a sign of being in love.. just embarassment..). So there is a slight possibility that he had a liittle notion of the crush.. but that's

all it would be..

AT that time.. he was friends with Zack.. who loved Aerith, and it is clear that she loved him too... .. I think they're my favorite pairing...

Aand they are canon too.. bwahaha yaay for square actually giving us something XD..

I can't waait for CC to come out.. .. if you've seen the trailer.. it looks so COOL!

Zack is.. amaazing! He's great!

Okay anyways.. back to the original idea.. my brain went off on a tangent..

So.. Zack was obviously stronger mentally/physically and Cloud had a bad reaction to the ...jenova cells..mako... i'm really spacing out on exactly what it was, but it was one of the two...

And remember Cloud comes out as a vegetable, a vegetable with a horribly messed up mind.. .. which is probably part of the problem... .. All of his "boy discovers girl" years.. and spent in a tube.. which gives him mental problems.. . So i'm not sure.. if he knows exactly how to love a person... or if he even knows what it is..

That's just at theory.. I'm not sure if i believe it, but i know my friend does..

I think.. with Aerith and Tifa's .. multiple counseling sessions.. he is slowly.. regaining some of his mind, although he is still the wacky mental breakdown guy we love..

Yeah her not telling him.. makes her more human.. haha calling something pixelated human :P

Ahh yes.. they have done that before, in the RPG games.. where there is always one big boobed bimbo... who trails after the main character.. and is constantly in danger... and can't do anything.. and has a bad attitude.. blah..

Oh yes, i'm not arguing that Aerith didn't help.. she definitely did.. and she did things that Tifa couldn't do... such as providing the cure for geostigma..

I hear you, Raven! It's nice to speak to intellectual people! ^.^

~Fran

XD yeess he is... and i think it did.. which is amusing..

You knooow.. Aerith first meets Zack.. in the church.. the exact same way she later on met Cloud..

He falls thorough the roof...

I think she is attracted to cloud at first.. because he reminds her of Zack, and later comes to love/care for him.. example from the date scenario..

Aeris: "What a shock..... I didn't know Zack was from this town." / Cloud: "You know him?" / Aeris: "Didn't I tell you? He was my first love."(Final Fantasy VII)

This is from wikipedia.. but before everyone cringes away :P .. It is actually referenced.. and is legit.

Although the maiden who travels the planet hasn't been disputed as of yet.. it wasn't written by the story line guy... it was done thorough square by another author.... .. I'm not sure how significant that is.. buut...

that book states she preferred Cloud.. and it also says Zack.. aand... someone else.. helped her save the world at the end of the game ..

I don't doubt her feelings for Cloud.. but I do think she truly loved Zack.. even though she said it wasn't serious.... from parts of the Crisis Core trailer.. it looks like she loved him.. .. and i guess some say you never forget your first love....

But that doesn't mean she can't love Cloud more.. I won't argue with that.. XD.. I just like the zack/aerith thing.. it's cute....

Aww.... it's so sad they both die..

~Fran

~Fran

.. Buut.. Squall is brought back... wait nevermind... i'll find out soon enough .. XD

OMG I know you said you don't mind spoilers but I'm SOOOO sorry! I mean, Squall doesn't die like "got stabbed through the heart" die but in a different way. It depends on how you see it, though.

~Fran

I personally haven't found any evidence to back up that they were engaged. However, I'm not denying she had feelings for Zack and was, at first attracted to Cloud because of Zack but, she was quite young and for her first relationship it's hard to tell if it's love or not. I mean with my first boyfriend, I always say "first love" out of habit but...after experiences with other boys I realised it wasn't really...

On another note...SQUALL DIES!!!!

What the heck is wrong with Square?! I'm going to send them to hell for this! :P

1)...Not telling your childhood friend that almost nothing in his memory is remotely real doesn't really indicate a lack of strength. It mostly indicates not being completely out of your mind. Cloud was going to have a breakdown eventually no matter what option was chosen. The fact that he had it in the Lifestream, where someone else could literally get into his mind and help him through it, was simply convenient. Otherwise, he might have simply ended up another useless Copy making his way to the Reunion.

2) Tifa also had memory problems of her own. She clearly doesn't remember at least one event from when she was younger, and with the retcons in LO/BC, she doesn't seem to have a very clear recollection of the Nibelheim Incident herself. That could easily lead to the conclusion that she didn't tell Cloud not only for fear of what would happen to him/what he'd do, but the fear or uncertainty regarding her own memories.

I do agree with what you have said, but I still think that her mental/emotional aspect are weaker than her physical strength. I'm not saying she's just muscle, it's just that she needs to improve within to improve others (i.e. "dilly-dally shilly-shally") Elaboration on that later.

I agree with that though. She's obviously more powerful in a physical sense than in a mental/emotional sense (Not to say that she's stupid or an emotional wreck, simply that she's got some issues).

Although the maiden who travels the planet hasn't been disputed as of yet.. it wasn't written by the story line guy... it was done thorough square by another author.... .. I'm not sure how significant that is.. buut...

that book states she preferred Cloud.. and it also says Zack.. aand... someone else.. helped her save the world at the end of the game ..

1) There's a problem people tend to ignore with that though. She says that she "Loved him more than her first love" within the first few paragraphs. Later on, she finds out and admits that she barely even knew the real Cloud, and that she saw a lot of her first love in him. For some reason, people just seem to brush the comments later on in the story off though...

2) It was all the souls in the Lifestream tha aided her. The only ones specifically mentioned were some of the ones she spoke with (Zack, Dyne, Biggs, Wedge, and Jessie, IIRC), but the entire Lifestream and the souls in it were involved.

But you know me, I can't resist a healthy debate.

I CAN'T, I CAN'T, IT'S IN MY BLOOD.

Um...not really. She said they weren't in a serious relationship :s

But let's not forget that the important part is that Aeris, at this point, hasn't received word of Zack's death because, well, nobody was around to witness it except for Cloud, and it's unlikely that the soldiers who killed him would care to send word to everybody who meant something to him. And obviously Cloud didn't remember that all to well xD So think about it... at this point, Aeris's first boyfriend has left his post in Midgar and hasn't written since, he’s a ladies man and she knows it, and he HASN’T CONTACTED HER. I think she would draw the conclusion that he found someone prettier/more attractive/smarter, whatever, and attempt to convince herself that it wasn’t serious, and thus lessen the hurt of being rejected. I highly doubt she’d want to admit to herself that it was a serious thing that he just left behind without a second thought. Because let’s face it, they did have something together and Aeris DID hold a lot of feelings for Zack. Fact.

I'm not denying she had feelings for Zack and was, at first attracted to Cloud because of Zack but, she was quite young and for her first relationship it's hard to tell if it's love or not. I mean with my first boyfriend, I always say "first love" out of habit but...after experiences with other boys I realised it wasn't really...

It is hard to tell but you say so yourself, she had feelings for him. And strong ones too.

I believe Aeris makes a better companion for Cloud. She is a healer and he was broken long before the begining of FFVII

A good thought. But not all healing comes from being proficient with a Restore Materia. Tifa can heal Cloud too because she knows the heart of his problems, she knows him better than Aeris, she cares about him unquestionably and will wait for him forever because she loves him. And I think Cloud needs that kind of devotion and patience to help him get through his messed up mind.

I didn't criticize Tifa in the slightest, but you have to admit, Aeris pretty much saved the world twice. She destroyed Meteor and eradicated Geostigma.

Tifa is cool, but apart from killing baddies that's pretty much all she did, apart from a few other things.

Destroying Meteor wasn’t entirely her doing. Holy, in the end, didn’t save the world. The Lifestream did. The game even says Holy ended up doing more damage than helping. However, I am not insulting Aeris or the things she has done for the planet, because she has undoubtedly given plenty to the world and done much for it. She did cure Geostigma, and that was perhaps one of the greatest things she has done. And I commend her for it, but that doesn’t automatically push Tifa to the wayside or make her the perfect choice for Cloud.

Ahh… erm… well, I don’t know how to say this, but those “few other things” were quite a lot, considering that she helped Cloud find his real self, she watched over him in his time(s) of need, she smacked some sense into him, she took care of her (their) family, she protects those she cares about, etc. That’s not to say Aeris didn’t do loads, but Tifa did much, much more than just “kill baddies”. One must give her more credit.

Aerith has always been one of my favourite characters. Yeah she couldn't fight very well but she was an amazing healer and her magic attack were as powerful as Cloud's!!!

She had so much to cope with, being the last Cetra was the cause of so much pain. I mean, her father is shot when she's just a baby, she and her mother were taken and experimented on for most of her childhood. When they escape, her mother dies and she has to live with a complete stranger. For the rest of her time in Midgar, she has to run away from the Turks who are constantly chasing her! She's been through so much strife(ha ha bad pun xD) and yet she smiles and never says a bad word about anyone or anything. Women don't have to be physical fighters to be considered strong!

Aeris rocks like that. She is beautiful and strong and cheerful throughout all of the things she has been through, and that’s what makes her such an admirable character. That’s also what makes Tifa so cool too, because even though her mother died, her father died (at the hands of Sephiroth), her hometown was burned to the ground, and she had to live in the slums, she remains hopeful and a happy person. And she lives to kick major ** too ^^ No, women don’t have to be physically strong to be emotionally strong, and Aeris is a great representation of that, but Tifa is both.

When she died I was just shocked. She was a great character, one of the best and Square killed her! *shakes fist*

I accidentally spoiled that for myself before I played xD But it was a very dramatic moment and quite emotional. However, I think it lent a lot towards the overall theme of FFVII, and it contributed very much towards the growth of all the characters. A wise move on Square’s part, I think.

Then in AC despite the fact she's dead, she comes to Cloud and helps him through his pain, she heals the Geostigma, she pushes him back to Earth. She's not the silly little damsel in distress princess alot of people make her out to be!

She does heal Geostigma, but I think Tifa was more of the one who helped Cloud shove through his thickheadedness. However, I don’t deny that Cloud needed to hear Aeris forgive him. I think that for that, it wasn’t a matter of what Aeris said, but the fact that it was Aeris forgiving him for letting her die. Because Cloud’s guilt was a big deal in AC.

P.S: Cloud/Aerith forever! xD

Well, you all know how I feel :P

For everyone here, put it this way. Tifa is physically strong while Aeris is mentally and emotionally strong. Simple as that!

Tifa does have emotionally weak moments, but overall she’s mentally strong too, and I think her flaws only serve to make me like her even more. I like people who seem human and relatable, who are understandable on the level that they have imperfections too. So I still think Tifa is pretty strong both ways.

The thing is, if Tifa was just a tad stronger, she would have told Cloud that all the things he said about his supposed "past" were all lies. Tifa herself agreed with Cloud's wrong past, not wanting to ruin it for him. If it wasn't for her, Cloud wouldn't have gone through the whole Lifestream-memory process in the first place.

Strength had nothing to do with this. Tifa sensed Cloud’s weak state of mind (hence why she hired him for AVALANCHE- to watch over him) and when he retold an entirely different version of the events at Nibelheim, she was probably confused and doubted her own memories, because that was probably the most traumatic night of her life and it’s quite likely that her memory would fail in lieu of that, so she probably doubted her own version of things. Also, had she told Cloud outright that he was wrong, he probably would have had a breakdown anyways. Because it would basically be like when Sephiroth told him that he was just an experiment and that the things he thought had happened at Nibelheim hadn’t, really. But I think VinCon summed up what I wanted to say beautifully.

Tifa is strong emotionally too but with the Nibelheim stuff she had Cloud to help her through since he was there and experienced it. Aerith had nobody who could come close to understanding what she went through.

*scratches head* What? I’m sorry, I don’t mean to seem rude, but I don’t get how Cloud helped her through that. In the real version of things, to her, Cloud didn’t even show up and she had to deal with that all on her own. She didn’t even realize that he went inside the reactor and picked her up and moved her to a more comfortable position until they went into the Lifestream. She had to deal with that entirely on her own. If anything, Cloud had Tifa to help him through his past traumas. Cloud didn’t even remember the Nibelheim events correctly- he hardly was able to help her through them.

It's just, in my opinion, Aerith was that little bit stronger because of her past. And both Aerith and Tifa are equally patient with Cloud in AC. Okay, Aerith didn't have 2 kids to bring up as well but you can tell BOTH girls are trying to help Cloud through in their own way.

Meh, once again, I think Aeris is incredibly strong emotionally and a great inspiration to all girls out there. And yes, both Tifa and Aeris are patient with Cloud, though Tifa has been waiting for Cloud for years upon years (and I don’t just mean waiting for him to come home), and she still has the patience to be so understanding (until she snaps a little and gets him off his lazy ** in the bedroom scene xD), but yes, both girls are trying to help Cloud in their own way.

I think Aerith's role was a guider for Cloud, protector of the Planet and...maybe a reassuarance to Avalanche that she's still with them.

Absolutely. Totally. And definitely. She is Cloud’s guardian angel, protector of the planet, and a reassurance to AVALANCHE that she’ll be there for them. You were right on spot there.

Just… not his one twue lubb xP

Squenix has a tendency to kill off people, doncha know? First Aeris, then Auron and Tidus...MURDERERS!!

Oops, forgot Squall! XP

SPOILARZZZ (for X, and if you still want a warning, Raven)

Auron was undead for awhile :P And Tidus isn’t technically DEAD. And he’s quite alive if you get the proper ending in X-2 (though I’d like to think of that game as a happy blip on the part of Square’s judgment).

Ah, noez, when did Squall die? I’ve played the entire game, don’t worry, but I don’t recall that xD Might be my failing memory.

Rend, a CloTi told me about it and how Zack and Aeris were *supposedly* engaged at some point.

Meh, never heard that before, but who knows.

Okay, okay, I’m done. DONE. Sorry, guys, I couldn’t resist. Sue me not?

(Geddit? Sue? Mary Sue? Maybe not, that didn’t even make sense…)

- WAS

One thing though: Destroying Meteor wasn’t entirely her doing. Holy, in the end, didn’t save the world. The Lifestream did.

Ahh but she did.Aeris rallied all the souls in the Lifestream though to rise up and defend the Planet and stop Meteor. That was her doing. From Maiden who travels the Planet:"Lend me your power, everyone!"

Aerith cried out. Her waves of thoughts expanded through the Sea of Mako. Carried by the Lifestream, it spread throughout the Planet.

"I can't do this alone. Lets all protect the Planet!"

The cry of the last Cetra shook the countless consciousnesses that she had awakened during her journey. The entire Planet's conscious was awakened. Of course, among them was also the consciousness of those that were suspended for their atonements. With their strong wills combined together, they managed to control the enormous energy of the Planet.[...]Under their command, countless streams of light appeared on the surface, intertwining together with the Lifestream. Then covering the Planet protecting it like a net, it slipped beneath Meteor and pushed the battering ram from outer space back. The movement of light was like a valkyrie leading her immortal army, riding across the heavens.

It's a nice image, isn't it? What I think is funny though that Aeris had to be killed by Sephiroth and enter the Lifestream to rally the troops so to speak. If Sephiroth hadn't killed her he would have succeeded with his plan and it would have been game over. Now that's irony. :)

Ah, noez, when did Squall die? I’ve played the entire game, don’t worry, but I don’t recall that xD Might be my failing memory.

I think what they're referring to is in the ending when Rinoa finds the collapsed and unconsciousness Squall and starts to cry. I honestly thought he was dead as well, which made me feel all warm and squishy inside. (Apologies to all Rinoa and Squall fans. I just don't like them). Then the power of Tru Wuv (blagh! hack! spew!) or sorcery or a magician brought him back. Hooray. :p

There are a lot of things Sephiroth could've done that would have allowed him to succeed. In fact, if not for his personal vendetta with Cloud, he probably could have pulled it off even earlier. Let's look at some of his mistakes:

- Everyone thought he was dead. Then he alerted the most powerful military organization on the planet to his presence by stabbing their president on the back and slaughtering several floors of office workers, leaving at least one witness, as well as his legendary sword, in plain sight.

- Released Cloud (Who threw him over a ledge, while impaled, when he was sixteen) and Crisis Avalanche from Shinra custody. Shinra very well could have executed all of them (Besides Red/Aerith, who they probably would have continued experimenting with) and saved him a lot of trouble.

- Left a blatant path to his location by either killing people, or leading his Copies around. A path which both Shinra and CA followed.

- Risked losing the Black Materia to CA just so he could make Cloud give it back a second time.

- Killed someone who ended up stopping his plans because being dead enabled her to do so (Though this was admittedly both unpredictable, and partially due to CA/Cloud defeating him in the final encounters, preventing him from acting in retaliation).

- He was holding back Holy with the power of his will. After his body was destroyed, and the only remaining thing left of him was his consciousness (Meaning they couldn't stop him, as they were incapable of touching him), he pulled Cloud's consciousness into a duel that allowed his borderline-unstoppable form (When faced with living opponents) to be destroyed.

- In AC, instead of simply biding his time and killing off the planet with Geostigma, he formed KYLE and attempted to start the Reunion again. And, once again, this drew the attention of CA, the Shinra remnants, and then the World Regenesis Organization (Though they apparently didn't do much...Would've been nice to have them around when Bahamut Sin was tearing the place up).

- Then when fighting Cloud yet again, instead of simply ending the fight when he could have, he played around with him to make him suffer. Which led to him leaving himself open for Cloud's new attack.

He really just needs to get a grip, and stop messing around. Honestly, by the time of AC, it had been roughly seven years since Nibelheim. He needs to just drop the damn grudge.

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CRISIS CORE SPOILERS AHEAD: YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED

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But let's not forget that the important part is that Aeris, at this point, hasn't received word of Zack's death because, well, nobody was around to witness it except for Cloud, and it's unlikely that the soldiers who killed him would care to send word to everybody who meant something to him.

1) Actually, it's highly implied that Aerith sensed his spirit entering the Lifestream. Apparently, Maiden has been rendered more or less non-canon (She doesn't realize Zack is dead in Maiden, but clearly seems to sense it in CC).

2) Tseng saved ninety-eight letters that Aerith had written for Zack, and planned to give them to him when he was recovered. Unfortunately, the Shinra military found him before the Turks. However, the point is that Tseng was on good terms with both Zack and Aerith, and probably would have informed her of his death if given the time. However, he literally died just hours (Possibly days) before FFVII takes place. After his death, Cloud walks to Midgar where he's found by Tifa, and takes the job we see him in at the beginning.

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END SPOILERS

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I didn't criticize Tifa in the slightest, but you have to admit, Aeris pretty much saved the world twice. She destroyed Meteor and eradicated Geostigma.

And Aerith probably wouldn't have been able to do so without help from the living characters. The first time, Sephiroth was already holding back Holy. If Cloud and Co. hadn't defeated Sephiroth, it's likely that he could have prevented her from acting as well (Seeing as he's confirmed as having the most powerful will in FFVII).

Then in AC, Aerith seems to be pretty much absent from the world (Physically) for the most part, while Sephiroth now has not only his incredible will power, but control over his own separate branch of the Lifestream (Created through Jenova/Geostigma) to add to it.

Plus, simply saving the world doesn't really make for an automatic couple. If you really want to get down to who "saved" the world, it could even be said that Sephiroth saved the world, though indirectly, through his arrogance, seeing as it was his arrogance and pride that lead to his defeat.

She does heal Geostigma, but I think Tifa was more of the one who helped Cloud shove through his thickheadedness. However, I don’t deny that Cloud needed to hear Aeris forgive him. I think that for that, it wasn’t a matter of what Aeris said, but the fact that it was Aeris forgiving him for letting her die. Because Cloud’s guilt was a big deal in AC.

To be completely honest, I think it was a combination of Tifa, Aerith, Marlene, Vincent, and Cloud himself. He wanted forgiveness from everyone, but it took all of them to finally get it past his thick skull that they had already forgiven him, and he was the only one still holding himself responsible.

The thing is, if Tifa was just a tad stronger, she would have told Cloud that all the things he said about his supposed "past" were all lies. Tifa herself agreed with Cloud's wrong past, not wanting to ruin it for him. If it wasn't for her, Cloud wouldn't have gone through the whole Lifestream-memory process in the first place.

Actually, Tifa's choice was more likely than not the most sensible one. Her own memories were in question, and bringing it up with Cloud could cause serious problems for both of them. Cloud was recalling events that, from what she knew (Seeing as she didn't know he was there), it should have been impossible for him to know. Not only that, but there were several alterations to the story in Cloud's "flashback" sequence.

Her not telling him hurt him in the long run, yes. But at least in that scenario, both of them were forced to confront it in a place where they could actually help clear his memories up (The Lifestream). What would have happened if she'd told him, and he'd broken down right there in Kalm? He would be stuck in his "Copy" state early on in the game, with no way to get into his head and fix things.

Telling him would have just been a major risk.

Squenix has a tendency to kill off people, doncha know? First Aeris, then Auron and Tidus...MURDERERS!!

Oops, forgot Squall! XP

SPOILERS FOR VII/VIII/X/X-2

Aerith is...Dead. Yep. Auron wasn't really alive when we met him, so they didn't really kill him off. Tidus was never technically alive in the first place (And is alive again depending on the ending), and Squall didn't die. He was temporarily lost in Time Compression, but he was fixed up in the end there.

END SPOILERS

Aerith was 16 when she dated Zack. It was her first interest. I think she thought it was love but really it was just infatuation. I think it's cute too and it's one of my favourite pairings but I don't think they were together.

I think it went deeper than infatuation.

CC Spoilers!

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What she had with Zack went very deep and she held on to every reminder she had of her time with him while he was gone (the ribbon she wears in her hair, the pink clothes she wears, even the flower-selling business was a legacy of Zack). And many of her flirting interactions with Cloud were like deliberate recreations of what she had with Zack; her pickup line of "One date!" to Cloud, for instance, was one that Zack used on her. Not to mention that, in CC, she told Zack that he had 23 simple wishes in her life, and all of them could be summed up in one: She wants to be with Zack more.

As for Zack, he may have been described as a ladies' man, but I don't see anything in the Compilation that shows that he was so flirtatious with others. He was easygoing and was able to speak and joke with them, but all I saw was that the women were more likely to come on to him than the other way around. He was pretty devoted to Aeris. And he fought his way back to Midgar for her, waded through hordes of Shinra soldiers with an invalid in his care, because he wanted to make sure that Aeris was safe and he could take her away from danger.

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End of CC spoilers

From all of that, I think it's undeniable that Zack and Aeris were together. They may not have had the chance to make it to the engagement stage, but they clearly loved one another.

I knew about the Church thing. Rend, a CloTi told me about it and how Zack and Aeris were *supposedly* engaged at some point. But then that totally ubndermines the "not a serious relationship" thing...

As I saw it, Aeris said that to convince herself because she wasn't ready to face the truth that her first love was dead and the closest thing she had to having him again was this blond man in front of her who acts, speaks, and fights just like him.

Zack and Aeris were the real tragedy romance in FFVII, IMO. They had so much to look forward to, and they were clearly heading in that direction, but both their lives were cut short. At least they're together in the Lifestream now... and Aeris is finally able to have her wish of being with Zack more. It's a rather unorthodox happy ending :)

*claps at hgblob's post* Beautiful, just beautiful.

It was obvious even in the FFVII that Aerith really did love Zack. Why would she have just told Cloud all her business? To her, Zack was never coming back. She was trying to put it behind her. Elmyra basically tells Cloud to back off because the last thing Aerith needs is to be hurt again. So, obviously, Aerith was deeply affected by Zack's disappearance. I mean, you can't be hurt by a fling. Not so much that years afterward her mother feels the need to send away a man that resembles Zack in almost every aspect.

I fully agree with you. Zack and Aerith are the tragic couple of Final Fantasy VII. ^^

Yeah, I reacted at the same thing, it's weird...

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