Kataang or Zutara?
This argument has come up a lot, what are your opinions about Kataang and Zutara? Which pairing is more likely? Do you think they're age differences really matter? Everyone's invited! Keep it respectful, though.
New Follow Forum Follow Topic
Page 1 2 3 4 .. Last Next »
Tiburontooth

why the creator change Katara's love interest from Zuko to Aang? need this for my new project.

PS : sorry, i cant stand if someone missunderstands Zuko as a maniac murder

7/27/2010 . Edited 8/8/2010 #1
Card'sShadow

The creators changed it 'cuz of all the little kids that ended up watching the show - they wanted to expand their audience, I guess.

7/28/2010 #2
Teyashi

They changed it because they feel the main character needed a love intrest to have a 50's style neat little ending. #1 man usually ends up with #1 woman like the Quarterback with the Captain of the Cheerleaders. I know it's overused and cliche, but tell Viacom that. By the way, does anyone realize the The Last Airbender was a silver screen version of The Ember Island Players?

7/28/2010 #3
micman60

Hey, it was bound to happen. Aang was travelling wth her since day 1, they knew each other better. Zuko tried to kill them of several occasions, not to mention he joined the bad guys at the end of Season 2 after Katara nearly used her rather PRECIOUS Spirit Oasis water to heal his scar. Plus, not all good girls like bad boys you know. You say that the hero getting the girl is a 50's cliche? At least our cliche isn't the end result of some underachiever's dreams of getting the "perfect girl" in class. Seriously, it's a crappy cliche that stinks of the 80's, among other things.

Then there's the argement that Katara needs a man, not a kid. As far as i'm concerned, Zuko is a mopey little emo with daddy issues, not a man. Zhou = man. Zuko = teen.

And, of course, tying in wth my 1st rant, a personal favorite from what i've seen: Opposites Attract. Ever written a "steambender" fic that involves Zuko and Katara getting hot and heavy? That's kinda creepy, you know, with them both being TEENS and all. At least "cloudbender" stories don't have underage consental r***.

I'm almost tempted to rant about the "Oedipus Complex" thing with Katara and Aang, but i'll keep it short: it's only an Oedipus Complex if it's with your own mother. Doesn't matter if she's the closest thing he ever had to one, doesn't count unless they're from the same end of the gene pool.

So, in closing, Zutara wouldn't of worked. For one, people don't fall in love with people who try and kill them/people they care about. Kidnap and abuse, yes, but not outwardly try to kill them, to get daddy's approval especially. Secondly, the "Opposites Attract" thing is trash and is the result of acid and child stars naming what they feel inside once they stop being cute. And finally, the old "She's His Motherly Figure, Kataang = Oedipus Complex" is invalid as they aren't exactly related. Doesn't count unless they're related by blood.

Feel free to flame, gentlemen and ladies. Let the games begin.

8/1/2010 #4
Bilinda Sorkin

It was dropped along with other things...Katara was called Kya, Sokka was more serious, Zuko had a pet messanger hawk, TOPH and AZULA WERE GUYS, several minor people were changed completly or not there, Iroh was going to be working for Ozai all along...

Alot of things got changed, Zutara amoung them.

8/2/2010 #5
BLISStheROGUE

out of all the points proven, urs is the hardest to beat. (not like I was going to rant on u or anything.) I have to agree with you on all those things and also throughout the show all the 'Zutara' moments, were really just biulds of friendship and trust, and also repetitive support on both their parts. Anyway, in conclusion I believe that ur prove a really, really good point in all of ur statements. I really admire u! ;)

8/2/2010 #6
Tiburontooth

excuse me .. Kill?

when? what episode?

8/3/2010 #7
Dukeofnachos

*raises hand*

Excuse me, but Zuko never tried to killanyone, just capture Aang. He would have left Sokka and Katara alone, had they given Aang to him. (which would have been a bad Idea.) He's not really a bad boy. Just a conflicted kid with a scar and swooshy hair who chose to help save the world in the end. And almost every character has some form of parental issues. Toph and her parents, Aang misses Gyatso, Katara misses her mom, Zuko'smom went missing with no explanation and his father banished him. Even Azula had problems with her mom.

Zuko and Katara aren't opposites. Zuko's opposite is really most likely... Aang.

And Zutara would have worked if the creators had wanted it to. They originally did. They changed their minds.

And if they hadn't, we'd be sitting here arguing about whether or not Katanng would work.

Katara mothers everyone. Even Zuko to an extent. There was an episode that pointed this out, in which she had lines written intentionally to promote this image.

THE END

(thinking about it: so rare it's a superpower.)

8/4/2010 #8
Amira Elizabeth
Where are you all getting the info that the creators had originally planned zutara? All the interviews I've read have stated katara and aang were planned from the start, in the DNA of the thing.
8/5/2010 #9
BLISStheROGUE
Dukeofnachos

wow... just wow. This is the best explanation i've ever read... *bows in praise* HOW CAN ANYONE BEAT THIS?!?!?! This is such a great explanation that if you read it, this should once and for all put the mad debates to an end. I officially idolize you!!! (and ur right, u can really consider her maternal figure a superpower.) other than that, you were totally right about everything else

8/5/2010 #10
Dukeofnachos

Where are you all getting the info that the creators had originally planned zutara? All the interviews I've read have stated katara and aang were planned from the start, in the DNA of the thing.

It was amoung the list of things that were dropped before the series began. Not during, as from episode one, you could see Kataang forming, though it didn't yet have a name.

wow... just wow. This is the best explanation i've ever read... *bows in praise* HOW CAN ANYONE BEAT THIS?!?!?! This is such a great explanation that if you read it, this should once and for all put the mad debates to an end. I officially idolize you!!! (and ur right, u can really consider her maternal figure a superpower.) other than that, you were totally right about everything else

Oh. My. God. Someone just agreed with me. But... it's not 2012 yet...

8/7/2010 #11
Tiburontooth

before i post, i apologize for the bad english.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

it's from the second episode where Zuko first met Sokka, Katara and Aang.

and you know what? i believe the creators denied this issue just to stop the hyper fan girl's screaming over Zutara OMFG and others.

why would Katara blush over Haru but not Zuko?

why Zuko blush over Toph but not Katara?

they both just do simple things, but Zutara did more intimate than that.

and if you see when Zuko and Katara said "She's not my girlfriend" "Im not his girlfriend" per frame, you will see actualy they are blushing.

what im trying to say is : i could feel somehow the creators actualy feels the chemistry between them (but it was an accident. they go with the flow, and Zutara just happen without planing) so the creators tries to prevent it at all cost. like .. Katara should love Aang! Aang should have Katara! LoL .. dont take it seriously, it's just a wild thinking.

yes, i think Zutara is a serious treat to Kataang. (judging by some posters here ... i believe if someone get upset or insulted, even they judge something on one side, it means they think something make them like that is a serious treat)

dont take the fact as it's raw... you should believe in yourself. after all, Bryke and Mike maybe Gods in Avatar universe, but we as fans are God into our own fandom too ^_^. with all respect, please continue the debate ...

8/8/2010 #12
Tiburontooth

Excuse me, but Zuko never tried to killanyone, just capture Aang. He would have left Sokka and Katara alone, had they given Aang to him. (which would have been a bad Idea.) He's not really a bad boy. Just a conflicted kid with a scar and swooshy hair who chose to help save the world in the end. And almost every character has some form of parental issues. Toph and her parents, Aang misses Gyatso, Katara misses her mom, Zuko'smom went missing with no explanation and his father banished him. Even Azula had problems with her mom.

that's right. that's why i wonder whyhe would said that

Zuko and Katara aren't opposites. Zuko's opposite is really most likely... Aang.

i'd prefer his opposites is Azula. you know, the manipulate thing.

And Zutara would have worked if the creators had wanted it to. They originally did. They changed their minds.

And if they hadn't, we'd be sitting here arguing about whether or not Katanng would work.

i bet if they want it in Zutara ways, Katara will not have her necklace back in eps Bato of the Watertribe. but in COD :D

she heals Zuko, Zuko give her necklace back, they begin the friendship, so Zuko dont have to betray everyone, and I bet, lightning will not have to strike Aang. Zuko didn't have to go home to learn that it was not his father's love or honor that he search for all this time. it will happen earlier in episode Lake Laogai and The Earth King.

8/8/2010 . Edited 8/8/2010 #13
Gatekla

Where are you all getting the info that the creators had originally planned zutara? All the interviews I've read have stated katara and aang were planned from the start, in the DNA of the thing.

Avatar Extras.

8/19/2010 #14
Mrs Pettyfer

^ I saw them in the Extra's too on Nick. It was mentioned in the extra's in Book 1 near the beginning when we meet Zuko I believe.

8/19/2010 #15
Amira Elizabeth

That thing was Nick yanking your chains. Nick was responsible for a lot of misleading shipping info and marketing.

8/19/2010 #16
TigerShadow

I agree with AE. Truth be told, Zutara wasn't ever planned. The creators are just masters of ship tease and wanted to go the extra mile with Zutara, which is easily the fandom's most popular ship. Zutara wasn't planned from the beginning; Kataang and Maiko were...the difference is that Kataang was actually fairly well-done (characters' ages aside), while Maiko was done rather poorly in my opinion.

11/6/2010 #17
Mrs Pettyfer

I think this question can only be addressed to the creators because it really was on the extras. Which I find it odd that Mike and Bryan would okay with something like that to be broadcasted if it wasn't true. As the creators, I'd think they have to okay everything that gets presented with ATLA. I mean if I had a fandom and Nick said something completely untrue, I'd probably have them take it down. But that's just me..unless they didn't mind fans to think that. The truth of the matter is, Zutara could have been planned early on in the creating process. Before they started making episodes, which is what I understood it to be. I think once they got into creating the episodes, they changed their minds and decided Aang would end up with Katara...just like Toph being a guy. (that's why you see a guy earthbender in the opening credits..that was Toph) And so they just threw in some teasers for fun. That's what I think at least. It was probably planned at some point, but early on before they started making the show.

11/15/2010 #18
ckrets

Yeah, to the people who think Zutara was "originally planned" sorry. I feel bad, but that's Bryke trolling on their fandom because they got sick of Zutara. Exactly why they made the pop ups and Ember Island Players.

I feel bad for Zutarians 'cause it's kind of rude to crush their hopes like that, but -shrug-

12/30/2010 #19
Mrs Pettyfer

^Lol By creating Ember Island Players I think they killed half of the Kataang fans with Aang's forced kiss and hissy fit.

12/30/2010 #20
Amira Elizabeth

Actually Nickelodeon was notorious for baiting the shippers as well. Look at the season 3 trailer where they had the EIP scene followed but the TSR hug between Zuko and Katara. The creators have consistently maintained that they had never planned on Zutara That it was a fan thing and they were actually a bit taken a back by it (if I remember from an article I read). In a couple of interviews they stated Aang and Katara's relationship/romance was in the "DNA" of the series.

I mean there was a magazine article I have a scan of that says that Katara was learning water bending, teaching Aang, and falling in love with him. It was some Beckett's collector magazine. The Earth kingdom books such as the "Tales of..." featured the characters exploring their feelings for each other. There was a whole book called "Love Potion #8" that featured a lovey-dovey Aang and Katara.

The studio knew that the fans were into romance and they played the card quite often with advertising, the pop-ups, and the merchandise.

Actually, the only ones who seem to make a big deal out of EIP are the Zutarians (which in all honestly doesn't make much sense considering half of their ship has behaved in a far less than exemplary fashion or you have Iroh who basically pretended to be paralyzed so the paralyzed June would lay on him). Most Kataangers, while not condoning Aang's behavior at all, certainly do not make the stink over it that the rival shippers do especially considering the behavior of the other characters. Aang realized what he did was wrong. He made a mistake. He was just as confused over the situation as she was. Where did he have a "Hissy fit" in that scene? In terms of characters having hissy fits Katara and Zuko take that cake on those throughout the series.

12/30/2010 . Edited 12/30/2010 #21
ckrets

Amira, your debating skills are always wonderful, whether here, on KF, or anywhere else. ;)))

12/30/2010 #22
Amira Elizabeth

Thanks. I am by no means perfect in debate and I don't claim to be. I have moments where my emotion takes over and I get really frustrated and annoyed. I cannot stand the twisting of the show or characters. But if you are going to get on Aang for his behavior, then Iroh laying under a paralyzed June or Zuko hiring an assassin to kill a 12 year old boy and his companions if they got in the way should merit just as much disgust if not more because Iroh is a grown man who should know better and Zuko's action was cowardly and he knew what he was doing.

The EIP scene didn't stop folks from liking the ship. As I said, no one that I know of condoned Aang's behavior in that scene. But no one that I know of wanted to crucify him for it either.

12/30/2010 . Edited 12/30/2010 #23
ckrets

Couldn't have put it better myself!

12/30/2010 #24
TigerShadow

Where did he have a "Hissy fit" in that scene?

He didn't. It's like when anti-Kataangers--Zutarian or not--say that Katara is a p*** for being in love with Aang. It's a lazy way to express their dislike of the relationship. In this case, they're basically saying that he interpreted "I'm confused" as "force a kiss" and didn't have much remorse over it besides the fact that he felt like it screwed up his chances with her. Of course, they're also probably taking into account his statements about the play in general (i.e. "Overreacting? If I hadn't blocked my chakra I'd probably be in the Avatar State right now!") as being a hissy fit, considering that it was just a play. They felt that his anger was taking the play too seriously and thus labeled it a hissy fit, which it actually might be. As usual with shipping, it's all a matter of opinion.

12/31/2010 . Edited 12/31/2010 #25
Amira Elizabeth

Well, let's see here if I just saw the person I liked being depicted with an older guy who was a former enemy I might be a little upset about the play too. Especially if I am a young man who is the hope for the world being depicted by a hyper-active woman. And especially if the person I liked is being shown laughing mockingly and saying: "Oh he's like a little brother..." And especially if I have been getting some signals that the person might be returning my feelings in the previous weeks.

It just might make one just might be a tad upset. Feeling insecure happens whether you are 12 or 62. Add to that Aang's burden of fighting the fire lord, stopping the war, and all of the other pressures on him.

Opinion is one thing but it is actually a matter of incorrectly labeling a character's behavior for the sake of putting down a rival ship.

12/31/2010 #26
TigerShadow

I never said that any of that was my opinion. It's the opinion of miscellaneous shippers, who aren't very well known for being reasonable (which is no slam on you, Mrs Pettyfer, I promise!). As I said before, it's a lazy expression of discomfort. Again, compare it to "Katara is a p*** for liking Aang!" Some random anti-Kataanger made a snarky remark comparing Katara to a p*** for various reasons, including the maturity and age differences I myself have already mentioned, and the fandom exploded. I personally do not think of the relationship as Katara being a p***--she cannot be by definition--but that's the way it works in fandom. There are the majority of the Zutarians here, who are relatively calm about the whole thing...and then there are the Zutarians that are completely ripmess insane.

Although I must point out here...you think Zutarians are bad, as far as labeling characters for the sake of their ship? Try the Harmonians...oh, my word, they're completely nuts. Take the craziest Zutarian troll you can think of, multiply that by about twenty thousand, and you get the Harmonians. As far as I know, Zutarians don't completely demonize Aang and Mai for the sake of Zutara--they may point out character flaws, but they don't demonize. Harmonians think that Ron is going to sexually/physically/verbally abuse Hermione and/or r*** her if they get together, and most Zutarians don't feel that way about Aang and Katara. Personally, I'm counting my blessings!

1/1/2011 #27
Amira Elizabeth

A. I never said any of it was your opinion.

B. I don't care about the Harry Potter fandom.

C. We all have levels of what is ridiculous. And the stuff I have read about Aang, about EIP, about killing the fire lord, about TSR, about Aang in relation Zuko, the twisting of the characters, the twisting of situations, etc. IMO is ridiculous. The stuff I've read in this forum recently has made me shake my head wondering "W**?" numerous times. And no, a lot of the p*** comments have been directed at the shippers themselves.

1/1/2011 #28
TigerShadow

A. That wasn't necessarily directed at you; people on the internet have habits of taking things out of context and I didn't want anyone thinking that was actually my opinion because on shipping forums in particular, people have habits of freaking out. However, it would have been a bit smarter to place those words in a post that wasn't directed at anyone in particular. My bad...

B. I didn't figure you would, but I was pointing that out because Zutarians aren't as bad (I'm not sure that they have their own page on Fandom W***, which is a plus) and, when pointing out that certain things shippers say are completely insane, one should always be reminded that there are things that are beyond the impossible (though I must admit, some of the things I see Zutarians say seem to be the codifier for utter ridiculousness, if that's a word).

C. So we do. I think a lot of that just comes from bad writing and not being able to correctly interpret characters. Some of that comes from the trollfics, yes, but some comes from just not being talented at writing.

The thing about forums is that you never know what kind of people are going to be on and what their basis is for arguing a point. I don't think any Internet forum is immune to people wondering what went wrong, it's just that some aren't very vocal about it.

You must have seen a lot of bitter anti-Kataangers then, because a lot of p*** comments I've seen are to the ship (of course, which ever it is, ship or shippers, that doesn't make the comments any less inaccurate).

1/2/2011 #29
Mrs Pettyfer

Oh boy, I should clarify the term hissy fit it seems! lol This is referring to Aang and Katara's talk:

Aang: I thought we were gonna be together, but we're not.

Katara: Aang...I don't know.

Aang: Why don't you know?

Katara: Because we're in the middle of a war, and we have more important things to think about. This isn't the right time.

Aang: Well, when is the right time?

Katara: Aang, I'm sorry, but right now, I'm just a little confused.

{Aang kisses Katara, who recoils slightly.}

Aang was clearly jealous over what the actress Katara said. He was upset that Katara didn't correct the words, that she didn't know why they weren't together, etc. And he reacted; he stormed out of the play...was it when actor Zuko and actress Katara got together? And then he kissed her..after she said she was confused. I summarized that fiasco as a hissy fit..but call it what you want. So yes TS, you were right there that the 'hissy fit' was based on his overracting to the play and his behavior with Katara. :P If it makes everyone sleep better to call it his insecurities or some other term than go for it, lol. Now the EIP didn't make me dislike Kataang...I already didn't ship it before then. That scene simply made me believe more firmly that Aang isn't ready for ANY romantic relationship..Katara or any other girl. (Not that I'd suggest it to a 12 year old, Avatar monk or not, anyway)

For the record, Aang knew he was wrong and it was a mistake, right? Did he ever actually apologize to Katara for his behavior? Because I honestly don't remember. Lmao I don't even think the awkward moment and kiss was even mentioned again after the EIP. Big flaw in writing in my opinion but whatever...I guess Katara's confusion is omitted and solved without the audience being informed.

I don't see how Katara could be a p*** for liking Aang...lol. I've never understood that arguement considering they're 2 years apart.

Lmao. Are we really talking about Jun and Iroh? That was a laugh. What Aang did was not funny, in my opinion. I don't have time to get into every single characters bad behavior on the show..that would take ages. I believe I was talking about Aang's behavior in the EIP..which is completely off topic to Iroh, Jun, Zuko, and every other character. I don't think I need to 'get on' other characters bad behaviors all because we're talking about Aang. The topic wasn't bad behavior of all the characters...I'm only talking about one situation, one character. Iroh and Jun...Zuko...that's another topic.

1/2/2011 . Edited 1/2/2011 #30
Page 1 2 3 4 .. Last Next »
Forum Moderators: LadyLore3 ScatterSunshine50, moaaa, TimeWitch'93
Rules:
  • Forums are not to be used to post stories.
  • All forum posts must be suitable for teens.
  • The owner and moderators of this forum are solely responsible for the content posted within this area.
  • All forum abuse must be reported to the moderators.
Membership Length: 2+ years 1 year 6+ months 1 month 2+ weeks new member