Helpful Hints for Coming Up with LotR Story Ideas
Need help with a story idea? Want to write an LotR story, but don't have an idea? I'm here to help.
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lotrelves
If you have story ideas you're not sure about posting, I'll be glad help you and you give advice.
5/31/2007 . Edited 7/18/2007 #1
spiritstallion
Should I write a presquell to the pebble and wounded?
6/5/2007 #2
lotrelves
What is a presquell? Do you mean prequel?
6/5/2007 #3
lotrelves
I don't think Wounded needs a prequel, unless you want to just have a short prologue showing what happened to Gandalf. Since Pebble is the sequel to Wounded it already has a prequel.
6/5/2007 #4
BrushbetheUndead
ya know i got an idea that I personally think is ok(kinda got a horse fetish heh heh) it kinda goes along with an old story i've been writing for at least three years. legolas' mother dies and is locked in a world of sorrow until he meets a mare from rivendell, and is returned to the world of light. so, whatcha think? i think it's ok, just haven't really gotten around to it. please be gentle!
6/11/2007 #5
lotrelves
[q]so, whatcha think?[/q] I think it is actually a very interesting idea. I haven't seen anything like it, so it is definitely different. You might want to run it by more people so that you see their views on it as well. Good luck!
6/11/2007 #6
spiritstallion
I think it sounds interesting! I say go for it! :)
6/15/2007 #7
AC2
Hello Lotrelves, hope it's okay with you if I post on your forum. Is it okay to make general suggestions about stories? If not, please by all means delete this. What it is, I have been reading through the stories posted in the LOTR section, and to be honest, most of them are AWFUL. The worst ones usually feature people from our world or self-inserts. Sometimes writers post stories in which LOTR characters end up in our world. To be fair, I have seen two fairly good ones, but most of them are dreadful. So here's my suggestion: how about encouraging people to write about the characters without putting "outside" stuff in? I am aware that you are in the middle of one of those "Girl from our world drops into Middle Earth" stories yourself, and am not setting out to offend you. It's just that I have found that the best stories are about LOTR only, not LOTR with "foreign bodies" in. What surprises me is the number of people who only seem to like Mary Sue stories. What's with that? Don't they like LOTR?
7/5/2007 #8
lotrelves
[q]hope it's okay with you if I post on your forum. Is it okay to make general suggestions about stories? If not, please by all means delete this[/q] It's fine that you posted here. I'm not in the habit of deleting things. [q]What it is, I have been reading through the stories posted in the LOTR section, and to be honest, most of them are AWFUL. The worst ones usually feature people from our world or self-inserts. Sometimes writers post stories in which LOTR characters end up in our world. To be fair, I have seen two fairly good ones, but most of them are dreadful.[/q] It is true that quite a few of them are dreadful, but I like to be encouraging. After all it is their idea. I do, however, also encourage changes in their plot lines. I give quite a bit of con crit. [q]So here's my suggestion: how about encouraging people to write about the characters without putting "outside" stuff in?[/q] I've actually done that on a couple occasions. If you've seen the questions above, you'll notice that there are no outside people. [q]I am aware that you are in the middle of one of those "Girl from our world drops into Middle Earth" stories yourself, and am not setting out to offend you.[/q] I'm not offended. My story is going to be a lot different than others. Believe me. I'm also rewriting it right now, so there will be a lot of changes to what is already on the site. [q]It's just that I have found that the best stories are about LOTR only, not LOTR with "foreign bodies" in.[/q] I've found that out too. Some of my favorite stories are like that. [q]What surprises me is the number of people who only seem to like Mary Sue stories. What's with that? Don't they like LOTR?[/q] I don't know. I'm personally not the biggest fan of Marysues. Make sure to tell me if my story starts to turn into one. I don't want it to. Thanks for your input!
7/5/2007 #9
spiritstallion
Could you do a Gimli, Legolas and Aragorn friendship story?
7/6/2007 #10
lotrelves
Do you mean write, give ideas, or edit?
7/6/2007 #11
AC2
Hello again Lotrelves, what's your definition of a Mary Sue? Mine is a girl from our world dropped into the fandom world. It gets worse when she is immediately accepted and everyone apparently speaks English. It gets even worse when she embarks upon a romance with a canon character. Sometimes these girls from our world have deluded themselves that they are canon characters, or are canon-based OC's. They manifest themselves as extra daughters of Elrond or some other canon character, tenth walkers in FOTR, extra-canonical baddies or characters that act out of character in a story that is unrecogniseable as a fandom one. Sometimes they are cast as canon characters - we've had Gilraen having an affair with Elrond. She's upset about being newly widowed, you see, and Elrond is lonely after not being with his wife for 500 years or so. Anyway, they end up creeping into bed together... What do you and your contributors think?
7/6/2007 #12
lotrelves
[q]what's your definition of a Mary Sue? Mine is a girl from our world dropped into the fandom world. It gets worse when she is immediately accepted and everyone apparently speaks English. It gets even worse when she embarks upon a romance with a canon character.[/q] Pretty much the same, except without the part of a girl from our world falling into the universe. I've actually seen some very good OCs. I especially love the funny ones. I can't stand the canon character romance. That's why my OC won't be falling in love with any of the canon. [q]Sometimes these girls from our world have deluded themselves that they are canon characters, or are canon-based OC's.[/q] I've seen that. [q]They manifest themselves as extra daughters of Elrond or some other canon character, tenth walkers in FOTR, extra-canonical baddies or characters that act out of character in a story that is unrecogniseable as a fandom one. Sometimes they are cast as canon characters - we've had Gilraen having an affair with Elrond. She's upset about being newly widowed, you see, and Elrond is lonely after not being with his wife for 500 years or so. Anyway, they end up creeping into bed together...[/q] Elrond only had one daughter! I will never create a tenth walker. That Elrond/Gilraen thing is just creepy.
7/6/2007 #13
AC2
[q]Elrond only had one daughter! I will never create a tenth walker. That Elrond/Gilraen thing is just creepy.[/q] Thank you. I have written OC's too, but they are canon-based. An OC doesn't have to come from our world. Surely girls from our world are idealised (or not!) versions of ourselves. They act as we would like to say we acted if we were in that situation. One I whacked had a girl with a badly sprained ankle going for an hour's hike, fondling a gate then ending up in Rivendell!! I have broken both my ankles, and let me tell you, I didn't need a doctor to tell me to take it easy - because it flippin' hurt!! I don't care that the girl was short and fat, etc, as far as I was concerned it was a Sue.
7/6/2007 . Edited 7/6/2007 #14
lotrelves
[q]Thank you.[/q] You're welcome. :) [q]I have written OC's too, but they are canon-based. An OC doesn't have to come from our world. Surely girls from our world are idealised (or not!) versions of ourselves. They act as we would like to say we acted if we were in that situation.[/q] I don't idolize my OC at all. She acts (or will act) in ways that I think are wrong. [q]One I whacked had a girl with a badly sprained ankle going for an hour's hike, fondling a gate then ending up in Rivendell!! I have broken both my ankles, and let me tell you, I didn't need a doctor to tell me to take it easy - because it flippin' hurt!! I don't care that the girl was short and fat, etc, as far as I was concerned it was a Sue.[/q] I read that story. I've sprained my ankles numerous times. It does hurt.
7/6/2007 #15
AC2
To idealise a person is to make the person ideal, i.e. as perfect as possible. To idolize is to make that person into a god. You might idolize Orlando Bloom, for example, so when writing about him (if real-person fics were allowed), you might idealise him. Many people, myself included, believe that adding a few faults to a character makes them more interesting. Therefore an idealised version of ourselves might not be actually perfect, i.e. having no faults, but more socially acceptable than we ourselves are. I have a TON of ideas for self-insert stories, but they are all silly daydreams in which I am stronger and wiser than I really am. Even if I came up with one in which I was an Anti-type of Sue, i.e. short, fat, lazy and annoying, it's still a Sue. Because it's an opposite side of the same coin. So I promise not to write them!! I must admit I do find ways to sneak myself in sometimes. What it is, I'll write about a character who is either canonical or canon-based, in which the character does and says the kind of things I would do in that situation. In "The She-Dragon of the Shire," Bilbo acts a bit like me, and Mistress Proudfoot, an OC, IS me, but idealised. The truth is, if Lobelia Sackville-Baggins came to my house to bully me, I'd be a lot more likely to cave in than to stand up to her, especially if others were watching!!
7/6/2007 . Edited 7/6/2007 #16
lotrelves
[q]To idealise a person is to make the person ideal, i.e. as perfect as possible. To idolize is to make that person into a god. You might idolize Orlando Bloom, for example, so when writing about him (if real-person fics were allowed), you might idealise him.[/q] Oops. My mistake. I was confused.
7/6/2007 #17
AC2
[q]My mistake. I was confused.[/q] THat's the story of my life, right there!! ;)
7/6/2007 #18
lotrelves
[q]THat's the story of my life, right there!! ;)[/q] *laughs* Thanks for the definitions. :)
7/6/2007 #19
lotrelves
[q]Many people, myself included, believe that adding a few faults to a character makes them more interesting. Therefore an idealised version of ourselves might not be actually perfect, i.e. having no faults, but more socially acceptable than we ourselves are. I have a TON of ideas for self-insert stories, but they are all silly daydreams in which I am stronger and wiser than I really am. Even if I came up with one in which I was an Anti-type of Sue, i.e. short, fat, lazy and annoying, it's still a Sue. Because it's an opposite side of the same coin. So I promise not to write them!![/q] I'm trying to add faults to my character. At the moment my attention isn't really focused on that story. [q]I must admit I do find ways to sneak myself in sometimes. What it is, I'll write about a character who is either canonical or canon-based, in which the character does and says the kind of things I would do in that situation. In "The She-Dragon of the Shire," Bilbo acts a bit like me, and Mistress Proudfoot, an OC, IS me, but idealised. The truth is, if Lobelia Sackville-Baggins came to my house to bully me, I'd be a lot more likely to cave in than to stand up to her, especially if others were watching!![/q] Hm, sneaking things in. That's a good idea.
7/6/2007 #20
AC2
Here's a thought: my understanding is that you want to write a story about a girl in Rohan. Does she HAVE to come from our world to make the story work? It's just that there are very few Rohan stories up on the site, and a story about a Rohirric girl would be interesting. I don't believe there are any stories up about a girl from that land, apart from Eowyn. A village girl, a serving girl - in Meduseld, perhaps. There's a bit in the movie ROTK that has the women going to Dunharrow to farewell the men. Eowyn doesn't HAVE to be the ONLY Rohirric woman to join the boys at Pellennor field... One big advantage is that she doesn't have to learn the language, which is a form of Adunaic different from the Westron Aragorn uses, and from the Common Tongue as well. She would already know that. She would, however, be a fish out of water among fighting men - or would she? According to canon, women learn how to use swords because they might still die upon them. A fish out of water story could have a village girl in Meduseld, perhaps reporting a raid... There's a gap before the Three Hunters arrive at Meduseld. Maybe they could rescue your OC... Although you don't plan to have your OC meet the Fellowship, if you follow canon closely enough, you could have some real, legitimate fun with her, and with them. You could have a whole troop of them - someone has to scrape Gimli off the floor after that movieverse drinking contest! And clean up afterwards! There's a lot of scope for using stuff from canon to build a story. You may decide to use these ideas in another story altogether. I'd be happy to help you if you like, I'm quite good at research.
7/6/2007 #21
lotrelves
[q]Here's a thought: my understanding is that you want to write a story about a girl in Rohan. Does she HAVE to come from our world to make the story work?[/q] Kinda. I plan on having her escape while Eomer and the riders are fighting the Orcs outside of Fangorn. I wanted to have it so she could get to Lothlorien by accident. I planned to have her in Lothlorien during the time the assaults happen. Then I planned on sending her out of Lorien in the direction of Rivendell. She gets lost, and that's all I have so far. [q]It's just that there are very few Rohan stories up on the site, and a story about a Rohirric girl would be interesting. I don't believe there are any stories up about a girl from that land, apart from Eowyn. A village girl, a serving girl - in Meduseld, perhaps. There's a bit in the movie ROTK that has the women going to Dunharrow to farewell the men. Eowyn doesn't HAVE to be the ONLY Rohirric woman to join the boys at Pellennor field...One big advantage is that she doesn't have to learn the language, which is a form of Adunaic different from the Westron Aragorn uses, and from the Common Tongue as well. She would already know that. She would, however, be a fish out of water among fighting men - or would she? According to canon, women learn how to use swords because they might still die upon them. A fish out of water story could have a village girl in Meduseld, perhaps reporting a raid...[/q] Hm, that's an interesting idea. Would you mind if I used something like that in another story? [q]There's a gap before the Three Hunters arrive at Meduseld. Maybe they could rescue your OC...[/q] Ooh, ooh, can I use it? I just got an idea for it. [q]Although you don't plan to have your OC meet the Fellowship, if you follow canon closely enough, you could have some real, legitimate fun with her, and with them. You could have a whole troop of them - someone has to scrape Gimli off the floor after that movieverse drinking contest! And clean up afterwards![/q] Ha. I think that would be interesting. Can I use something like that? [q]There's a lot of scope for using stuff from canon to build a story. You may decide to use these ideas in another story altogether.[/q] Ooh, I want to. I'm planning quite a few oneshots and canon stories as we speak. [q]I'd be happy to help you if you like, I'm quite good at research.[/q] I would greatly appreciate that. Thanks!
7/6/2007 #22
AC2
[q]Kinda. I plan on having her escape while Eomer and the riders are fighting the Orcs outside of Fangorn. I wanted to have it so she could get to Lothlorien by accident. I planned to have her in Lothlorien during the time the assaults happen. Then I planned on sending her out of Lorien in the direction of Rivendell. She gets lost, and that's all I have so far.[/q] Girl from our world. First in Rohan, then in Lorien, then in Rivendell. SUE!!! If such a thing really did happen, she wouldn't last five minutes unless she had Bear Grylls survival skills. If someone did pick her up they would be deeply suspicious. She wouldn't know the language, so would end up communicating in signs and grunts. She would probably end up as a servant in the kitchens or something. As a lone female with no protector and no status that would be the best she could hope for. If she did indeed escape, she has to: 1. Find food and water 2. Figure out a way to travel safely without being accosted by Orcs, Wargs, bandits or other assorted nasties. This is not a hike in a National Park. She has landed in a war zone. Walking by herself ain't an option. And she would be very much more vulnerable at night, when Orcs and Wargs come out to play... Don't forget she'd leave a scent trail everywhere she walks... 3. Figure out a way to obtain appropriate clothing, because the stuff she is wearing now would make her stick out like a sore thumb. Ever heard runaway stories of kids who have run away in our world? Sooner or later they end up at a disreputable place, where assorted wierdos and perverts are waiting to exploit them. These pervs and wierdos know how to spot these frightened, vulnerable, desperate kids - their body language and general air of neediness gives them away. They end up being made to do... unsavoury things... Since they need food, water and shelter, they go along with it. Since this girlie doesn't know the language or have a protector, she needs a protector. How will she find one? 4. She needs to be able to build a shelter of some kind at a pinch. It rains in Rohan, in Lothlorien and in Rivendell. 5. So who is this kind, self-effacing protector who would act as a chauffer-c**-bodyguard? Usually, the Fellowship or some canon character is drafted in. However, they have their own agends, so in a RL situation, they would ditch the girl as quickly as they could... If she was lucky, she'd end up as a tavern wench, being treated as a retard because people can be really horrible to those who do not know their language. If not, a cellmate for Gollum in Thranduil's dungeons... Now you understand why I whack Sues. They end up messing with canon sooner or later. I wonder if people write them because they believe they are easier to write than canon-based stories. They are if you don't care about writing well. If you want to write well, a good grasp of logic is essential. Sues fall down because they are illogical. ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; You can use every one of the ideas I have given you. I can think of more for you if you like.
7/6/2007 #23
AC2
Dratted profanity filter! I wasn't using a rude word there. I meant chauffer/bodyguard.
7/6/2007 #24
lotrelves
[q]Girl from our world. First in Rohan, then in Lorien, then in Rivendell. SUE!!! If such a thing really did happen, she wouldn't last five minutes unless she had Bear Grylls survival skills. If someone did pick her up they would be deeply suspicious. She wouldn't know the language, so would end up communicating in signs and grunts. She would probably end up as a servant in the kitchens or something. As a lone female with no protector and no status that would be the best she could hope for.[/q] Hence the reason she doesn't know the language. [q]Find food and water[/q] Yes that will be a big problem. *looks evil* [q]Figure out a way to travel safely without being accosted by Orcs, Wargs, bandits or other assorted nasties. This is not a hike in a National Park. She has landed in a war zone. Walking by herself ain't an option. And she would be very much more vulnerable at night, when Orcs and Wargs come out to play... Don't forget she'd leave a scent trail everywhere she walks...[/q] You're right about that. This is why I'm going to have her have "problems" along the way. [q]Figure out a way to obtain appropriate clothing, because the stuff she is wearing now would make her stick out like a sore thumb. Ever heard runaway stories of kids who have run away in our world? Sooner or later they end up at a disreputable place, where assorted wierdos and perverts are waiting to exploit them. These pervs and wierdos know how to spot these frightened, vulnerable, desperate kids - their body language and general air of neediness gives them away. They end up being made to do... unsavoury things... Since they need food, water and shelter, they go along with it. Since this girlie doesn't know the language or have a protector, she needs a protector. How will she find one?[/q] Yes, I've heard the stories. They creep me out. She will eventually have a protector. I have plans. [q]She needs to be able to build a shelter of some kind at a pinch. It rains in Rohan, in Lothlorien and in Rivendell.[/q] Ooh, I haven't thought about that yet. [q]So who is this kind, self-effacing protector who would act as a chauffer-c**-bodyguard? Usually, the Fellowship or some canon character is drafted in. However, they have their own agends, so in a RL situation, they would ditch the girl as quickly as they could... If she was lucky, she'd end up as a tavern wench, being treated as a retard because people can be really horrible to those who do not know their language. If not, a cellmate for Gollum in Thranduil's dungeons...[/q] She will have a protector. But, it won't be a Fellowship member. [q]Now you understand why I whack Sues. They end up messing with canon sooner or later. I wonder if people write them because they believe they are easier to write than canon-based stories. They are if you don't care about writing well. If you want to write well, a good grasp of logic is essential. Sues fall down because they are illogical.[/q] That is true. I, however, plan on doing a lot of research. [q]You can use every one of the ideas I have given you. I can think of more for you if you like.[/q] Thank you!
7/6/2007 #25
AC2
Glad to have been able to help you, Dear. Okay, how is she going to find and communicate with a protector who is NOT going to exploit her? It would actually be more realistic to give her a creep who abuses her, since that is more likely to happen - but we ought to leave it to the likes of Pervert101 to write it, eh? 'Scuse my cynical take on human nature. If you want to give her a protector, a widower who has lost his family in an Orc-raid is the most likely candidate for the job, sice he would need her as much as she would need him. However, leaving his home would be a huge wrench for him, because he would most likely only know his own language. Therefore, what would make him want to travel? If he is another kind of person, perhaps a travelling merchant or something, you could have something there. But why go to canon locations if she's not going to get involved in canon events? What will she do when she gets there? If the plan is to go to Rivendell solely to pick Elrond's brains to find a way home, how will he do it? What advice will he give? Clicking her heels together and saying three times, "There's no place like home" is an option, but it's not original. If this is a convoluted dream, like the Wizard of Oz, it could work. Logic is not strictly necessary in a dream. Irrational scenarios are de riguer, in fact. You could have a great deal of fun if you utilize ideas fromt he Wizard of Oz without ripping it off. Consider: 1. Dorothy dreams she is carried off in a storm. 2. She lands in Oz, but on the WWotW's sister. Aforementioned witch is seriously ticked!! 3. Dot immediately seeks a way home, so the Munchkins advise her to follow the yellow brick road, to go to the Wizard of Oz. 4. Dot meets three wise guys on the way. Adventures and complications ensue. 5. WWotW attempts to scupper Dot's chances of getting back to Kansas. She pulls some very nasty stunts and attacks Dot's friends. 6. Dot and friends battle witch. Teamwork ensures that the day is saved. 7. Dot and friends arrive in the Emerald City and meet the Wizard. Each of the friends want to ask the Wizard to give them a special gift: a brain, a heart, and courage. 8. Oh no! The Wizard is not what he seems! He is exposed, and has to leave because people now know what he is. This leaves our Dot stranded. 9. It's okay, the Good Witch of the South tells her to click her heels together three times, etc. 10. Dot wakes up in her own bed. ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; If we accept that TWOO is an original Sue story, we can admit that our story is a Sue and rejoice therein. Why? Because you're going to write the best one of those there is. It's nothing to be ashamed of. Now, I am NOT suggesting a cowardly lion, a scarecrow and a tin man as companion protectors for your Dot figure, or even that there should be three of them. However, you could use the vibe to write a wonderfully whimsical tale. What do you think?
7/6/2007 #26
lotrelves
[q]Okay, how is she going to find and communicate with a protector who is NOT going to exploit her? It would actually be more realistic to give her a creep who abuses her, since that is more likely to happen - but we ought to leave it to the likes of Pervert101 to write it, eh? 'Scuse my cynical take on human nature.[/q] It's ok. You have good point. [q]If you want to give her a protector, a widower who has lost his family in an Orc-raid is the most likely candidate for the job, sice he would need her as much as she would need him. However, leaving his home would be a huge wrench for him, because he would most likely only know his own language. Therefore, what would make him want to travel? If he is another kind of person, perhaps a travelling merchant or something, you could have something there. But why go to canon locations if she's not going to get involved in canon events? What will she do when she gets there? If the plan is to go to Rivendell solely to pick Elrond's brains to find a way home, how will he do it? What advice will he give? Clicking her heels together and saying three times, "There's no place like home" is an option, but it's not original.[/q] Hm, a merchant. That's a good idea. Can I use it? Yes the plan is to pick Elrond's brain on how to get home. [q]If this is a convoluted dream, like the Wizard of Oz, it could work. Logic is not strictly necessary in a dream. Irrational scenarios are de riguer, in fact. You could have a great deal of fun if you utilize ideas fromt he Wizard of Oz without ripping it off. Consider:[/q] A dream...that's a good idea, I think I'll use it. [q]If we accept that TWOO is an original Sue story, we can admit that our story is a Sue and rejoice therein. Why? Because you're going to write the best one of those there is. It's nothing to be ashamed of.[/q] I really want to write the best there is. [q]Now, I am NOT suggesting a cowardly lion, a scarecrow and a tin man as companion protectors for your Dot figure, or even that there should be three of them. However, you could use the vibe to write a wonderfully whimsical tale. What do you think?[/q] I think it's a splendid idea. I want to do something like it. Thanks!
7/6/2007 #27
AC2
Woo hoo! Looking forward to seeing the result of the rewrite. One of the best things about a dreamscape like TWOO is that the dreamer is unaware that she is dreaming. Therefore when stuff happens, she is pretty much free to react to it as she pleases. Have fun!!
7/6/2007 #28
lotrelves
[q]Woo hoo! Looking forward to seeing the result of the rewrite. One of the best things about a dreamscape like TWOO is that the dreamer is unaware that she is dreaming. Therefore when stuff happens, she is pretty much free to react to it as she pleases. Have fun!![/q] Thanks for all your help. I'll get to my story as soon as I can. P.S. Because I thought about the Wizard of Oz, I started humming "We're off to see the Wizard". :)
7/6/2007 . Edited 7/6/2007 #29
SCREAMINGwhispers
I'm actually writing a 10th walker at the moment...I'm trying to make it different than the others, though, and as canon as I can possibly make it. First all of, my protagonist is not drop-dead gorgeous. She's 9 years old right now (it's the prequel/origin story) black haired, wide grey eyed, too skinny, freckled half Dunadain from Bree. Also, she joins the Nine Walkers without permission, and on her brother's behalf. Inzil basically runs away the day AFTER they leave, and joins them. Could you read and review? Concrit is totally welcome!
7/8/2007 #30
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