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KP Fannie Committee

First of all, we would like to take the opportunity to thank everyone who participated in the 5th Annual Fannie Awards. Things were rushed and thrown together at the last minute due to unfortunate circumstances that we all wish could have been different. We thank everyone for helping to honor the memory of our friends who are no longer with us.

Seeing how it is June of 2011, we feel there is little time to waste with getting the 6th Annual Fannie Awards underway. These awards will be celebrating the best and most popular stories and authors in the Kimmunity in 2010. The first thing that needs to be done is getting the nominations for each category.

As you'll notice there are two new categories listed here. In the past for one reason or another, mature rated stories were not eligible to win Fannie Awards. At least that was the official policy, however the quality of the stories cannot be ignored. Therefore we decided to include a mature category to see how things will go. We hope that in the future this will not be necessary and that stories of any rating will be eligible for any category.

The other addition is the Wrongsick category, because let's face it, some stories out there just don't have an appropriate section to be recognized for their contribution to the Kimmunity.

We felt that a month would be plenty of time for people to e-mail in their nominations. With that in mind, we ask that if you have any nominations for stories that were started, continued or finished in 2010, that you send your picks to kimmunityfannies at yahoo.com. Any story from 2010 is eligible as long as it fits the criteria of the category. You can send nominations in for as many or as few categories as you wish. If you have any questions, comments or concerns please feel free to either PM this account or send us an e-mail.

Nominations will be accepted until Midnight Pacific Time on July 18th.

Without any further delay, here are the categories for the 6th Annual Fannie Awards:

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1 Best Original Character Name

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2 Best Original Character

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3 Best Minor Character

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4 Best Villain

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5 Best Songfic

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6 Best AU Story

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7 Best Crossover/Fusion

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8 Best Alternative Pairing Story

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9 Best KiGo Story

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10 Best K/R Story

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11 Best Comedy

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12 Best Romance

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13 Best Action/Adventure

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14 Best Drama

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15 Best Mature Story

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16 Best Wrongsick Story

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17 Best One-Shot Overall

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18 Best Novel-Sized Story (100,000 words or more)

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19 Best Short Story (15,000 words or less over multiple chapters)

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20 Best Series Overall

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21 Best Writing Team

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22 Best Young Author

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23 Best New Writer

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24 Best Story Overall

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25 Best Writer

XXXXXXXXXX

XXXXXXXXXX

Here is an up to date list of the current nominations for the Fannies. Remember to keep sending in your picks. Every person matters. Also we will be looking into nominations that don't meet the qualifications and removing them if/when we find them.

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1 Best Original Character Name

Faye Morgan (The Hyde Factor by Shallow15)

Moriarty (The Power of Kim by whitem)

General Arch N Emmy(Rise of Rhodigan by Nutzkie)

Grimm Probable (A Friend In Darkness by Slyrr)

Helen Dassak (At The Centerfold of the Storm by SHADO Commander)

Miracle Stoppable (only a mother's love by Sumer11)

Sherry Porter (Some of the News by Slipgate)

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2 Best Original Character

Alice Killigan (Wrongsick by PengyChan)

Ivan Gerhart (GVU: The Freshman Rush by AmericanGecko)

The Great Bear Spirit (Friend in Darkness by Slyrr)

Moriarty (The Power of Kim by whitem)

Ralph Emerson Shepherd, Henchman #85109 (At The Centerfold of the Storm by SHADO Commander)

Wayne Kingston (School Of Life by captainkodak1)

Xander Lipsky (Changes by AmericanGecko)

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3 Best Minor Character

Camille Leon (Karma Chameleon by Pojko)

Yori (Exam by MrDrP)

Joss Possible (Joss' Ride by Star-Eva01)

Monique (GVU: The Freshman Rush by AmericanGecko)

Betty Director (A Green Apple by eoraptor)

Bonnie Rockwaller (At The Centerfold of the Storm by SHADO Commander)

Bonnie (Sitches Aplenty by BenRG)

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4 Best Villian

Jack Hench (At the Centerfold of the Storm by SHADO Commander)

Moriarty (The Power of Kim by whitem)

Faye Morgan (The Hyde Factor by Shallow15)

Shego (Hop On Possible by SHADO Commander)

Kaji (Dragonfire by Reader101w)

Camille Leon (Karma Chameleon by Pojko)

DNAmy/Miss Go (Remember the Mat by daccu65)

Wayne Kingston (School Of Life by captainkodak1)

Zorpox (Across the Stars by Mahler Avatar)

Walter Nelson (CEO by Jurnee Jakes)

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5 Best Songfic

Strong Enough (captainkodak1)

Kim Da Yada (Slyrr)

Undercover Angel (Star-Eva01)

The Slash Writer's Guide to Better KiGo (SHADO Commander)

Save Me A Dance (captainkodak1)

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6 Best AU Story

For Fame, Fortune, and Freedom (Starving Lunatic)

Remember the Mat (daccu65)

Out There, In Here (BearSent176 [CajunBear73 / Sentinel103])

So The Bedtime Story (Pinky Jo Curlytail)

Kim Possible: Rebirth (mooseinthe mist)

The New Kid (Pojko)

The Rise of Requiem (kprockstar)

Middlewood (yvj)

Karma Chameleon (Pojko)

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7 Best Crossover/Fusion

Captain Possible and the Centurion Legacy! (Jurnee Jakes)

KP in Letter to Kim (Aero Tendo)

School Of Life (KP/Avengers) (captainkodak1)

KP: Green Lantern's Light (LJ58)

In Blackest Night (waveform)

The Dark Knight (Classic Cowboy)

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8 Best Alternative Pairing Story

Shego/Gemini (Agent Alpha by PengyChan)

Duff Killigan/DNAmy (Wrongsick by Pengychan)

Shego/Monkey Fist (Remember the Mat by daccu65)

Shego/Tara (Envy and Ambition by GreenWriterM)

Mr. Barkin/Electronique (Memorium Vitae by eoraptor)

Ron/Shego (Loving You Behind Closed Doors by Dayinel)

Bonnie/Ron Rieger (Ron's Big Date by Reader101w)

Ron/Bonnie (Rockwaller: on the Lam by Alice Shade)

Brick/Justine (Just A Jock by DoofusPrime)

Camille/Ron (Karma Chameleon by Pojko)

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9 Best KiGo Story

At the Centerfold of the Storm (SHADO Commander)

Of Blood and Bondage (sweetPixiesmile)

Kim Possible: A Blonde Moment (eoraptor)

Price of the Heart (Ffordesoon)

Hop On Possible or How Shego Stole Kimness (SHADO Commander)

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10 Best K/R Story

Remember the Mat (daccu65)

Rise of Rhodigan (Nutzkie)

KP: Green Lantern's Light (LJ58)

The Hyde Factor (Shallow15)

Dream to Dream (JA of JAKT)

Well-Suited (Pinky Jo Curlytail)

Only a Mother's Love (Sumer11)

expect the unexpected (HarryPotterTwin)

Abracadabra (The Enduring Man-Child)

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11 Best Comedy

Airliner! (Mahler Avatar)

Gifts (Pinky Jo Curlytail)

Draw! (DoofusPrime)

The Wright's Stuff (Nutzkie)

Price of the Heart (Ffordesoon)

The Slash Writers Guide to Better Kigo (SHADO Commander)

Quest of The "Sick and Wrong" (JA of JAKT)

Resolved: There's An Upside To Everything (RonHeartbreaker)

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12 Best Romance

Blue Jeans (sweetPixiesmile)

Rise of Rhodigan (Nutzkie)

Only a Mother's Love (Sumer11)

KP Reunion Royalty (Aero Tendo)

Bad As She Wants Me To Be (RoguesKnight)

Undercover Angel (Star-Eva01)

Turn the Other Cheek (eoraptor)

Soulmates (Chaos Lord)

I'll be Watching You (King In Yellow)

expect the unexpected (HarryPotterTwin)

A Very Possible Christmas Night (Slipgate)

Ginger Tea and Strawberry Toast (Pinky Joe Curly Tail)

Some More Drama (Slipgate)

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13 Best Action/Adventure

Another Time – Another Place – Another Adventure (JA of JAKT)

At The Centerfold of the Storm (SHADO Commander)

Captain Possible and the Centurion Legacy! (Jurnee Jakes)

1942 A Mim and John Story (JAKT)

Rise of Rhodigan (Nutzkie)

The Road Ahead (Reader101w)

Summertime Blues (Nutzkie)

Envy and Ambition (GreenwriterM)

The Most Dangerous Game (captainkodak1)

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14 Best Drama

Crippled (PengyChan)

The Secret Ingredient (DoofusPrime)

Another Time – Another Place – Another Adventure (JA of JAKT)

The Twelve Nays of Christmas (The Wise Duck)

Mr. Nice Guy (TheLon3Wolf8986)

Lineage: A Kim Possible Fanfiction (eoraptor)

The Dark Side of Wade (Reader101w)

The Healers' Touch (AlyssC01)

Karma Chameleon (Pojko)

Some More Drama (Slipgate)

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15 Best Mature Story

At the Centerfold of the Storm (SHADO Commander)

Not Long Enough (PengyChan)

Blue Jeans (sweetPixiesmile)

Envy and Ambition (GreenwriterM)

Strange Exchange (Gomro Morskopp)

Kim and Ron summer time fun (EnterpriseCV-6)

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16 Best Wrongsick Story

Wrongsick (PengyChan)

Eggnogged: The Night Before The Night Before Xmas (SHADO Commander)

The Slash Writers Guide to Better Kigo (SHADO Commander)

Mission Failure (Charles Gray)

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17 Best One-Shot Overall

Not a DUbious Distinction (noncynic)

Abracadabra (The Enduring Man-Child)

Soulmates (Chaos Lord)

Well Suited (Pinky Jo Curlytail)

Memorium Vitae (eoraptor)

Quit Playing Games With My Head (KT of JAKT)

Hop On Possible or How Shego Stole Kimness (SHADO Commander)

Curse of the Garden Gnome (Neo the Saiyan Angel)

Losing Shego (purplegirl761)

911 (whitem)

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18 Best Novel-Sized Story

Study of an Evil Genius (purplegirl761)

Remember the Mat (daccu65)

The Road Ahead (Reader101w)

Karma Chameleon (Pojko)

At The Centerfold Of The Storm (SHADO Commander)

Changes (AmericanGecko)

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19 Best Short Story

Strange Exchange (Gomro Morskopp)

Green Eggs and Kim (SHADO Commander)

Sympathy for the Devil (whitem)

A Date With Destiny (DoofusPrime)

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20 Best Series Overall

Well-Suited Universe (Pinky Jo Curlytail)

Changes (AmericanGecko)

All Things Probable (Slyrr)

The Mim and Jon tales (JA of JAKT)

In the Middle (StarvingLunatic)

Drakken story series (purplegirl761)

All Good Things (Jurnee Jakes)

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21 Best Writing Team

BearSent176 (CajunBear73 / Sentinel 103)

JAKT

NoDrog/LoveRobin

Team Whitecap

KP Fannie Committee

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22 Best Young Author

purplegirl761

KT of JAKT

Intoxmush

Sumer11

HarryPotterTwin

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23 Best New Writer

DoofusPrime

Pinky Jo Curlytail

AmericanGecko

Slipgate

SHADO Commander

kprockstar

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24 Best Story Overall

Just a Jock (DoofusPrime)

At The Centerfold Of The Storm (SHADO Commander)

Remember the Mat (daccu65)

Price of the Heart (Ffordesoon)

Work in Progress: Study of an Evil Genius (purplegirl761)

Karma Chameleon (Pojko)

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25 Best Writer

DoofusPrime

captainkodak1

daccu65

SHADO Commander

purplegirl761

Pojko

6/18/2011 . Edited 7/19/2011 #1
SHADO Commander

you send your picks to .

To your pm address? To Disney's copyright enforcement division? The Christy Carlson Romano for President campaign?

We pause for a brief subliminal suggestion:

And we're back. And thank you for the wrong sick category, as there's no other category Wrong Sick, Ron Sick would ever be eligible for.

6/18/2011 #2
KP Fannie Committee

Thank you SHADO for pointing out the error in the post. It has been fixed, though it is slightly roundabout due to ff.net's restrictions on what can be posted in the message boards.

6/18/2011 #3
Neo the Saiyan angel

And thank you for the wrong sick category, as there's no other category Wrong Sick, Ron Sick would ever be eligible for.

Naaaah. Technically it could also be nominated for Best Romance, Best One-Shot, and Best Alternate Pairing. Best Wrong-Sick is just the one it has the best chance in. :P

6/18/2011 #4
AmericanGecko

Are we allowed to make more than one nomination per category? Cause a couple of these I don't think I'll ever be able to narrow it down.

A.G.

6/18/2011 #5
KP Fannie Committee

In order to spare the awards from being clogged with nominations, an individual may only nominate one story or author per category.

6/18/2011 #6
AmericanGecko

Sent in my nominations this morning.

A.G.

6/19/2011 #7
Slyrr

Count me in :)

I'll compose my picks and send them as soon as I can. I've been busy the last couple weeks with parents in town visiting...

6/20/2011 . Edited 6/20/2011 #8
Karon19

Man, I don't read as much ff as I used to. I don't think I can vote for half these categories. But I'll give it my best shot.

6/20/2011 #9
whitem

So can we do any "Shameless Self Promotion"? (Big toothy grin)

Oh, and btw... do we want this topic pinned yet?

6/24/2011 . Edited 6/24/2011 #10
KP Fannie Committee

So can we do any "Shameless Self Promotion"? (Big toothy grin)

As a matter of fact, Whitem, a "Shameless Self Promotion" thread is more than welcome! Just make sure its in its own thread. ;)

Second, and just as a few reminders: Fics and/or authors and/or characters that won a given category during the prior year, won't qualify again the next year, but will again the year following (Fifth Annual Fannies/2009 Fannies winners wouldn't qualify for Sixth Annual Fannies/2010 Fannies, but would qualify for the Seventh Annual Fannies/2011 Fannies). To break that down a little bit, here's a couple examples:

First example: MrDrP's character Lyle Lott won the Fifth Annual Fannies/2009 Fannies Award for "Best Original Character Name", and if the individual character in that fiction (or that character, in a series, or that character, in a new fiction), was still going in 2010, then he, she or it would fall within the time period to be accepted for the Sixth Annual Fannies/2010 Fannies, but due to winning in 2009, that character could not be nominated for the Sixth Annual Fannies/2010 Fannies. If, however, that chracter was still going in that fiction (or series, or a new fiction) in 2011, that character would again be eligible and could qualify.

Second example: in the Fifth Annual Fannies/2009 Fannies, Slyrr won "Best Novel Sized Story Overall" with "A Friend in Darkness". For the Sixth Annual/2010 Fannies, "A Friend in Darkness" wouldn't qualify for that particular award, but if the series was still going in the time period to to be counted for the Seventh Annual/2011 Fannies, it would again qualify.

Remember, this is complicated due to the fact that we're doing what should have been last year's award's this year. We're still finalizing some aspects of the awards and the overall time that the 'cooldown' period after winning is in effect, but as it seems now, this is it. Please note, however, some of this information may change, but only for a small number of awards overall.

And finally, as far as nomination ballots are concerned, we're going to start posting who has been nominated for what here shortly. Do keep in mind, if a nomination for a given award has already, you're more than welcome to nominate another, or abstain from that particular award. :) But please remember, every nomination now, and vote later, counts, so don't be discouraged if a fic you want to nominate has already been nominated in a given category; there's plenty of categories and plenty of stories out there!

Thanks!

The Fannies Committee

EDIT: edited for (hopefully) clarity... ^_^;

6/25/2011 . Edited 6/25/2011 #11
SHADO Commander

Just one question... exactly what is the definition of 'Mature' as far as exclusions go. I was assuming that it referred to M+, but someone told me in a PM that it refers to anything higher than a T, which struck me as rather absurd given that the M is the equivalent to an MPAA R.

6/25/2011 #12
whitem

Another question (or two)

1. If a story was used in another contest, such as MrDrP's V-Daypalooza, is that story eligible for the Fannies too?

2. Well, thought I had another question, but I guess not.

6/25/2011 #13
AmericanGecko

Two things:

1) Personally I think entries to other contests should be eligible (and not just because I had a couple entries to them). Mainly, I believe this because some of these entries were simply too good, and should have a valid chance at having their greatness recognized.

2) Didn't realize a couple of my nominations were ineligible due to winning previously, so I'll be sending in my alternate choices for those.

A.G.

6/25/2011 #14
KP Fannie Committee

Well, here's a few answers for you guys. :)

Just one question... exactly what is the definition of 'Mature' as far as exclusions go. I was assuming that it referred to M+, but someone told me in a PM that it refers to anything higher than a T, which struck me as rather absurd given that the M is the equivalent to an MPAA R.

Mature as defined by FFN in the "Content Rating Guidelines" under the member control panel's "Rules and Guidelines" menu: "M; CONTAINS CONTENT SUITABLE FOR MATURE TEENS AND OLDER", and further broken down in that same section as follows: "Not suitable for children or teens below the age of 16 with possible strong but non-explicit adult themes, references to violence, and strong coarse language." More rules on this will follow in a post following this post, which will describe the acceptance criteria for "M" fictions and the "vetting process" we will use to make sure it's not pure smut or something that should be on an adult oriented site that somehow slipped past the FFN mods...

1. If a story was used in another contest, such as MrDrP's V-Daypalooza, is that story eligible for the Fannies too?

Basic requirements are that it's a Kim Possible fanficiton, and it isn't an "Adult's Only"/NC-17/MA fiction, and the fiction in question is either on FFN, or is able to be linked within the forum (for example, within the "Shameless Self Promotion" or other promotion threads), and is not in a viewing restricted area (forum with limited post viewing and limited membership eligibility, for example). In other words, it doesn't matter to the Fannies Committee if it was in another competition or not. Do be aware, however, that sometimes contests do not allow a fiction written for it to be used/accepted as part of another contest. This Fannie Committee member writing this post has never seen this restriction within the Kimmunity, but has seen it in other fandoms.

6/25/2011 #15
Pinky Jo Curlytail

Second, and just as a few reminders: Fics and/or authors and/or characters that won a given category during the prior year, won't qualify again the next year, but will again the year following (Fifth Annual Fannies/2009 Fannies winners wouldn't qualify for Sixth Annual Fannies/2010 Fannies, but would qualify for the Seventh Annual Fannies/2011 Fannies).

I know there's the fic announcing all the 2009 winners, but is there a simple list of them somewhere for quicker reference?

6/25/2011 . Edited 6/25/2011 #16
KP Fannie Committee

The award winners from the previous Fannies are:

Best Original Character Name - Lyle Lott

Best Original Character - Pete Peterson (Team Possible in the 8th Dimension) and The Mystical Monkey (A Friend in Darkness)

Best Minor Character - Mim Possible (1939) and Yori (Kunoichi)

Best Villain - Katerina Vozmozhniya (Fly Me to the Moon), The Supreme Empress (Reset) and Miss ANThropy (The Human Element Book II: Synthesis of a New Life)

See, this is why voting is important. Look at all these ties!

Best Songfic - Kimmie's Guy

Best Alternate Universe - 1939

Best Crossover/Fusion - BioniKim

Best Alternate Pairing - Shego/Monkey Fist (Farewell to the Mat)

Best Kigo - Most Wanted and One Way or the Other

Best Kim/Ron - 22 Minutes and School Days

Best Comedy - When Alien Abductions go Wrongsick

Best Romance - A Lot Like Love

Best Action/Adventure - Fly Me to the Moon

Best Drama - 1939

Best One-Shot - 22 Minutes

Best Novel-Sized Story - A Friend in Darkness

Best Series Overall - Best Enemies Universe

Best Writing Team - Star-Eva01 and JAKT

Best Young Author - Akinyi

Best New Writer - Sentinel103

Best Story Overall - 1939

Best Short Story - The Lord and Lady of Everlot

Best Writer - CPneb

6/25/2011 #17
SHADO Commander

Mature as defined by FFN in the "Content Rating Guidelines" under the member control panel's "Rules and Guidelines" menu: "M; CONTAINS CONTENT SUITABLE FOR MATURE TEENS AND OLDER", and further broken down in that same section as follows: "Not suitable for children or teens below the age of 16 with possible strong but non-explicit adult themes, references to violence, and strong coarse language." More rules on this will follow in a post following this post, which will describe the acceptance criteria for "M" fictions and the "vetting process" we will use to make sure it's not pure smut or something that should be on an adult oriented site that somehow slipped past the FFN mods...

Hold on… are you really saying that any story that's rated M on FFN is ONLY eligible for the Mature category, nothing else? Are you serious? You DO realize that a M on FFN is actually less stringent than a motion picture R rating or a TV MA, right? How can you have a contest for the "best" in fan writing if you have an exclusion clause that would automatically eliminate most of the NY Times bestsellers list, every series made for HBO or Showtime and every single Best Picture Oscar since 2004?

6/25/2011 #18
ThePlagueBeast

I hope you realize, SHADO, that previously Mature fics were not allowed anywhere near the Fannies at all. This is a step, hopefully, towards full integration.

If the category causes undue drama we'll simply remove it next year and continue the tradition of disallowing M rated fics.

6/25/2011 #19
SHADO Commander

I hope you realize, SHADO, that previously Mature fics were not allowed anywhere near the Fannies at all. This is a step, hopefully, towards full integration.

If the category causes undue drama we'll simply remove it next year and continue the tradition of disallowing M rated fics.

Er… disregarding the fact that I just went over last year's list and noted that there were actually two M rated titles in the list of winners, meaning that Pinky Jo's answer to my question was either incorrectly phrased or that the rules have been conveniently 'bent' in the past, my point is that there seems to be a global misunderstanding as to what the M rating actually means, which is similar to an R rating. Instead, what I've noticed repeatedly here is that people use the T rating for titles that should be M, while erroneously misconstruing M to mean stories about sex and therefore being the equivalent of the X/NC17… and as a result there's this weird bump-down effect that results in people putting up KiGo and RonRevenge stories labeled K, which is a patent violation of the guidelines given that the K means: Intended for general audience 5 years and older. Content should be free of any coarse language, violence, and adult themes.

Here's what a T actually is:

Suitable for teens, 13 years and older, with some violence, minor coarse language, and minor suggestive adult themes, which is basically the same as a motion picture PG-13 (full description direct from the MPAA at bottom)

Versus an M:

Not suitable for children or teens below the age of 16 with possible strong but non-explicit adult themes, references to violence, and strong coarse language, which is closest approximated by the R (again, full def at bottom.)

Note the key verbiage possible strong but non-explicit under M, while a T allows only MINOR use of adult themes and minimal violence. In other words, ANY story that deals with coming of age issues is going to skirt the M… many of Judy Blume's books like Blubber would fail the T test. Also ANY story with major violence IS automatically going to be an M, so parts of Twilight and Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows are all non-acceptable as T's… though where they flunk is on the violence end. On the other hand, most romance novels, even Harlequins, and any men's adventure novel, are all going to be M's.

But let's look at movies since it's the closest analogy. Here's a list of movies that have won the best picture Oscar since 1971 (when the PG and R ratings replaced the previous GP) that would NOT be eligible for the fannies.

The Godfather, The Godfather 2, The French Connection, One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest, The Deer Hunter, Ordinary People, Terms of Endearment, Amadeus, Platoon, Rain Man, Silence of the Lambs, Unforgiven, Schindler's List, Braveheart, The English Patient, Shakespeare in Love, Gladiator, Million Dollar Baby, Crash, The Departed, No Country for Old Men, Slumdog Millionaire, The Hurt Locker, The King's Speech.

God, what a lot of smut, huh? No, a lot of intelligent, well written stories, which is why R's have dominated the Oscars and Golden Globes for the past four decades. It's the rating that covers that areas where serious writers write.

And what the heck, let's drop back another two years and toss in the one "X" rated winner from before the creation of the R rating, Midnight Cowboy. You'd also not be able to consider all of Stanley Kubrick's Post 2001 –A Space Odyssey work except Barry Lyndon, just about everything Martin Scorsese's ever done, any of Blake Edwards non-Pink Panther Movies made after 1968, Alien, The Terminator, Animal House, ANY current horror movie, Apocalypse Now… heck, even a Disney movie like Splash would go into M territory (Hey babe, I've got a…)

Need I go on? The point is that the automatic exclusion of the M... if that's what Pinky Jo actually meant... would be a slap in the face of both intelligent writing AND those authors who took the time to actually read the guidelines and label them appropriately.

For reference:

PG-13 — Parents Strongly Cautioned. Some Material May Be Inappropriate For Children Under 13.A PG-13 rating is a sterner warning by the Rating Board to parents to determine whether their children under age 13 should view the motion picture, as some material might not be suited for them. A PG-13 motion picture may go beyond the PG rating in theme, violence, n***, sensuality, language, adult activities or other elements, but does not reach the restricted R category. The theme of the motion picture by itself will not result in a rating greater than PG-13, although depictions of activities related to a mature theme may result in a restricted rating for the motion picture. Any drug use will initially require at least a PG-13 rating. More than brief n*** will require at least a PG-13 rating, but such n*** in a PG-13 rated motion picture generally will not be sexually oriented. There may be depictions of violence in a PG-13 movie, but generally not both realistic and extreme or persistent violence. A motion picture's single use of one of the harsher sexually-derived words, though only as an expletive, initially requires at least a PG-13 rating. More than one such expletive requires an R rating, as must even one of those words used in a sexual context. The Rating Board nevertheless may rate such a motion picture PG-13 if, based on a special vote by a two-thirds majority, the Raters feel that most American parents would believe that a PG-13 rating is appropriate because of the context or manner in which the words are used or because the use of those words in the motion picture is inconspicuous.

R — Restricted. Children Under 17 Require Accompanying Parent or Adult Guardian.An R-rated motion picture, in the view of the Rating Board, contains some adult material. An R-rated motion picture may include adult themes, adult activity, hard language, intense or persistent violence, sexually-oriented n***, drug abuse or other elements, so that parents are counseled to take this rating very seriously. Children under 17 are not allowed to attend R-rated motion pictures unaccompanied by a parent or adult guardian.

6/25/2011 #20
ThePlagueBeast

SHADO, the ratings on the site are all that matter since the Fannies are hosted on the site. Everything else is functionally nonexistant. To be better explained in a few minutes.

6/25/2011 #21
KP Fannie Committee

As Kit said, this is a test to see the reaction of the Kimmunity overall. Yes, it's limiting, but please bear in mind that if the test is indeed successful, the Seventh Annual Fannies will begin in less than six months, and may include "M" fictions in general, or in their own categories. There are extenuating circumstances which forced the removal of the "M" category in the past, such as the fact that, at the time the Fannies started, many members of the reading Kimmunity, as well as several authors, were younger than FFN's 'age guidelines' for the "M" category.

With that in mind, we don't take the step of adding in an "M" category, nor thepossiblefuture addition of "M" categories in general lightly. After all, some of the more recent Kimmunity members here on FFN are, indeed, under the age of sixteen.

Now, we'd like to point out a comment in our earlier post: "More rules on this will follow in a post following this postst, which will describe the acceptance criteria for "M" fictions and the "vetting process" we will use to make sure it's not pure smut or something that should be on an adult oriented site that somehow slipped past the FFN mods..."

From every indication we have, the "M" category is a suggested guideline, which apparently holds true even with the FFN Mods. Some of us on the Fannies Committee have seen fictions, both within the KP FFN section, and others, that were blatantly adult material. Not just the motion picture "R" rating, but things that, realistically, would be NC-17 if they were films.

That said, there are many,manyworks that are, in a few words, high quality works of fiction. Works that, unfortunately, fall within the "M" rating category and have, up until this time, been deemed 'unacceptable' to be voted upon within the Fannies. Either through the use of language, sexuality or depictions of violence that are just too much for the "T" rating. What this award is for is to give everyone a taste of the high quality works of fiction that are, indeed, available in that rating category.

At this point in time, we're limiting it to one category, and depending on feedback, we will either open the Fannies in general to the "M" rating, or we will add a few more categories to expand the allowed "M" rated fictions to be up for consideration. If feedback prior to the initial voting phase (not nomination phase, mind you) is positive or negative enough, we will either expand with a couple of additional "M" awards for the Sixth Annual Fannies, or we will remove the award category entirely from the main Fannies Awards. Where we go from there will be determined at the point in time it comes to us.

And finally we get to the point. We realize it seems as if we're equivocating with all this buildup, and for that we apologize... However, it's important to establish the basics of the rules to follow. The "M" rating is, obviously, a classification of fictions on the site, and thebasequalification for such. In other words, any fic that's listed as "M", for this year's awards, will be up for consideration for that category, as per the rules of FFN.

That said, we know that there's some "M" fics that, upon mature and/or reasoned reflection, may not have needed the "T" rating. There are also some works that, quite bluntly, flaunt FFN's existing "M" rating and slip in something that's decidedly "Adult's Only". We will accept nomination ofanyfiction that's on FFN (or elsewhere, if proper links can be supplied) that is listed as an "M" fic or follows FFN's "M" guideline.

That brings us to the "Vetting Process" mentioned in our earlier post. The Fannies Committee is just that, acommittee! In the past, there was only one primary member of the Kimmunity putting this award out, occasionally with help, but limited help compared to the totality of the Fannies. We have, at the current time, five primary members, and two volunteers. As we receive "M" rated fics for consideration, we will read them.

Those members reading will decide if it's within the general guidelines of the "M" rating, as well as make decisions as to whether or not a given fic violates the rating, whether intentionally or unintentionally; this member will also make notes as to whether or not the fic skirts close to being edge of what is acceptable, and what those moments within the fic are. If it is deemed proper by one reader, than at least one other member will read it, and decide if they agree or disagree, and on what grounds.

If they agree, the fiction will be considered nominated, and listed as such. If the second member disagrees, their reasons will be discussed by several members of the Committee, and we will all either read either the whole fiction or (at the very least) the pertinent "questionable' content, and make vote on whether or not it should be considered nominated or declined. If it is declined, we will send a PM or email to the member that nominated it, as well as the author of the fic, with apologies and reasons why it was declined.

This, of course, isn't the best solution, but as it stands, it is the most optimal we've discussed. The members of the Fannies Committee are varied in not only their reading tastes, but what they consider 'proper' within a given rating. We are also all quite capable of being as objective as we can, within the bounds of an obviously subjective topic.

The goal of the "Vetting Process" is to avoid works that are purely tasteless smut, violence or "shock value". This does not mean, to use just one example, that a descriptive sexual scene that is tasteful will automatically result in the fic being rejected. If, however, the scene or fiction could be considered "excessive", it may result in this happening.

To use two KP specific examples of fictions that have been on FFN for some time, two works by Failte200: "Alone, Together", rated "T" and "Accidental Mistress", rated "M". In "Alone, Together", there were scenes that depicted violence, sexual contact, and even some fairly heavy duty curses. However, taken as a whole, they were, if just barely, considered "T". In "Accidental Mistress", there were several scenes that were bordering on smut levels of p***, as well as regular use of mature language. However, it all fit, within reason, within the bounds of their given age categories. "Accidental Mistress", were it written (or continued) in 2010, would likely have qualifed.

On the other hand, there have been works of fiction rated "M" that, in all honesty, should not be on FFN, due to rampant, some might say insulting, violation of the rules. Pure smut, aka p*** Without Plot, some of which were rather... Blatant, shall we say? And there are other works that were merely violence for violence's sake, or "gore p***" if you will. We could go on, but we believe our point has been made.

To use SHADOO's examples, fictions that have similar scope and quality to the movies he mentioned, such as "The Godfather", would very likely qualify for inclusion in the Fannies. After all, the violence, language and more mature themes were not presented as smut, "gore p***" or the like, but were part of a flowing, integrated whole, but targeted at an obviously more mature audience.

Overall, our goal is not to limit the "M" rated works of fiction that follow the "hard and fast" rules of the rating, but which, in the opinions of the Kimmunity and the Committee, are worthy of recognition due to high quality. But please try to keep in mind, we have to try and make the awards as "family friendly" as possible, while, more importantly in our opinion, recognizing those works as the Kimmunity, even those of the "M" rating. And in the future, we hope that, perhaps, we may indeed have "M" rated fics along side lower ratings, or voted on in parallel within the Fannies Awards, as the case may be, depending on the opinion of the Kimmunity as a whole.

-Thank you...

The Fannies Committee

EDIT: edited because FFN's forum doesn't like the term p*rn... ^_^;;

6/25/2011 . Edited 6/25/2011 #22
Lord Kellendros

In the past for one reason or another, mature rated stories were not eligible to win Fannie Awards. At least that was the official policy…

Mature as defined by FFN in the "Content Rating Guidelines" under the member control panel's "Rules and Guidelines" menu: "M; CONTAINS CONTENT SUITABLE FOR MATURE TEENS AND OLDER", and further broken down in that same section as follows: "Not suitable for children or teens below the age of 16 with possible strong but non-explicit adult themes, references to violence, and strong coarse language." More rules on this will follow in a post following this post, which will describe the acceptance criteria for "M" fictions and the "vetting process" we will use to make sure it's not pure smut or something that should be on an adult oriented site that somehow slipped past the FFN mods...

I hope you realize, SHADO, that previously Mature fics were not allowed anywhere near the Fannies at all.

…continue the tradition of disallowing M rated fics.

There are extenuating circumstances which forced the removal of the "M" category in the past, such as the fact that, at the time the Fannies started, many members of the reading Kimmunity, as well as several authors, were younger than FFN's 'age guidelines' for the "M" category.

Works that, unfortunately, fall within the "M" rating category and have, up until this time, been deemed 'unacceptable' to be voted upon within the Fannies. Either through the use of language, sexuality or depictions of violence that are just too much for the "T" rating.

M-rated fan-fiction stories, as defined by Fan Fiction dot Net's ratings criteria, have never been banned from being nominated for Fannie awards, as is proven by this list of the first four annual Fannie Awards contest winners, all of which contain M-rated stories, highlighted in bold type–including, if you will note, an M-rated entry by Zaratan, the man who started, maintained, and ran the Fannies for four years straight, and who would likely still be doing so were it not for his real-life issues:

1st Annual Fannie Award winners!

- Best Writer - MrDrP (eligible again at the 4th Annual Fannie Awards)

- Best New Writer - StarvingLunatic

- Best Story Overall – David Clark Allan, Shego Rocks!

- Best Series Overall – Allaine, Unacceptable Sitch series (eligible again at the 4th Annual Fannie Awards)

- Best One-shot Overall – Nate Grey, Chronic

- Best Novel-sized Story Overall - Hobnob-rev, Kim Possible: Mind, Body, and Soul

- Best Comedy – Cid Gregor, Mind Games: Redux

- Best Romance – Immo, A Few New Tricks

- Best Action/Adventure – CaptainKodak1, The Lotus Bloom

- Best Drama – Apoptosis, A Road Not Taken

- Best Songfic – Zaratan, Something More

- Best Crossover/Fusion – MrDrP, Kim Possible: The Next Generation

- Best K/R Story – CaptainKodak1, The Lotus Bloom

- Best Kigo Story – Hobnob-rev, Kim Possible: Mind, Body, and Soul

- Best Alternative Pairing Story (Ron/Bon, Kim/Drakken, etc.) – Zaratan, Life Changes

- Best Original Character – Hobnob-rev, Kara Fang

- Best Minor Character – Zaratan, Bonnie, and Mattb3671, Nooni (TIE)

2nd Annual Fannie Award winners!

- Best Writer - Commander Argus

- Best New Writer (2006) - (tie) King in Yellow & Cpneb

- Most Voted Writer - Starving Lunatic

- Best Story Overall – Alone Together - Failte200

- Best Series Overall – The Trinity Sitch - Commander Argus

- Best One-shot Overall – Zorpox and the Cheerleader - MrDrP

- Best Novel-sized Story Overall - The Gods Must Be Laughing - Starving Lunatic

- Best Comedy – It's Addictive - Spectre666

- Best Romance – Another Time, Another Place - Starving Lunatic

- Best Action/Adventure – Maternal Instinct - Blackbird

- Best Drama – The Darkness Within - GWA (G-Go, MrDrP, CaptainKodak1, Mattb3671, WesUAH, Commander Argus, Zaratan)

- Best Crossover/Fusion – The Batman - Classic Cowboy

- Best AU - Middlewood - Yvj

- Best K/R Story – The Ronless Factor - Scoutcraft Piratess/Zaratan

- Best Kigo Story – Alone Together - Failte200

- Best Alternative Pairing Story (Ron/Bon, Kim/Drakken, etc.) – In the Middle - Starving Lunatic

- Best Original Character – Isabel Gooding - Walking the Line - Starving Lunatic

- Best Minor Character – Bonnie - In the Middle - Starving Lunatic

- Best Original Character Name - Kasy and Sheki - Kasy/Sheki series - NoDrogs

- Best Villain - Kara Fang - Kim Possible : Mind, Body, and Soul - Hobnob-rev

- Best Single Line - Starving Lunatic - One in a Billion - Shego - "What the? Where have you been these past few years? When the woman says she's on a plane, chances are she's actually in a cab on the way to the house! I don't want to get caught by her!"

- Kim Possible Achievement Award - Zaratan

3nd Annual Fannie Award winners!

- Best Original Character Name - Deidre "Dee" Lusional - Match Ado About Nothing – MrDrP

- Best Original Character - Grimm Probable – All Things Probable Series – Slyrr

- Best Minor Character – Tara – Mating Games – Campy

- Best Villain – Zorpox – Taming a Slave – Johnrie18

- Best Songfic – Over You - Zaratan

- Best AU – Honor Bound – StarvingLunatic

- Best Crossover/Fusion – Possibles Of The Caribbean – Twila Starla

- Best Alternative Pairing – Ron/Bonnie – The Pathetic Tale of Bonnie Rockwaller – Blackbird

- Best Kigo – Best Enemies: Redux - King in Yellow

- Best K/R – Tunnel Vision – CaptainKodak1

- Best Comedy – Hottie's Home – spectre666

- Best Romance – ilyiw: Christmas with my New Daddy – cpneb

- Best Action/Adventure – Ron Stoppable, Ultimate Monkey Master – Quis Custodiet

- Best Drama – TIE - Inside, Looking Out - Charles Gray and What She Can't Say – The Wise Duck

- Best One-Shot – Sweet Dreams - MrDrP

- Best Novel-Sized – Tunnel Vision – CaptainKodak1

- Best Short Story – Legacy – JAKT, Given to mkusenagi2 and Kathleen Ellen Anne O' Connor

- Best Series – All Things Probable series – Slyrr (eligible again at the 6th Annual Fannie Awards)

- Kim Possible Achievement Award - Allaine

- Most Voted Writer – Cpneb

- Best Writing Team – The Ronless Factor – Backroads/Zaratan

- Best Young Writer – Akinyi

- Best New Writer – JAKT

- Best Story – Tunnel Vision - CaptainKodak1

- Best Writer - CaptainKodak1 (eligible again at the 6th Annual Fannie Awards)

4nd Annual Fannie Award winners!

Best Original Character Name - Leigh Gality - Friend in Darkness – Slyrr

Best Original Character - tie:

Professor Moriarty - The Power of Ron - Whitem

Rhonda Fatigable - All Things Probable Series - Slyrr

Best Minor Character - Joss Possible - JadeKimVerse – cpneb

Best Villain - Professor Moriarty - The Power of Ron - Whitem

Best Songfic - Bonnie, Your're a fine girl - Star_Eva01

Best AU Story - 1919 – MrDrP

Best Crossover/Fusion - The Iron Man Project – Noobfish

Best Alternative Pairing Story - Drakken/Potato - Potato Madness - Neo the Saiyan Angel

Best Kigo Story - Lust Potion Number 9 - Whitem

Best K/R Story - 8 Nights: Help Us - Ran Hakubi

Best Comedy - tie:

KR vs. Kigo - MaceEcam

Law and Disorder - MrDrP

Best Romance - 1919 – MrDrP

Best Action/Adventure - A Friend in Darkness - Slyrr

Best Drama - A Christmas Sitch - jakt

Best One-shot - tie:

A Box of Cuddle Buddies Redux – CaptainKodak1

Mom, Me, and Mary – jakt

Best Novel-Sized - Undercover – Michael Howard

Best Short Story - 1919 - MrDrP

Best Series - Blue Eyes, Shining – cpneb

Most Voted Writer - Slyrr

Best Writing Team - jakt

Best Young Author – kt, of jakt

Best New Writer - Michael Howard

Best Story Overall - A Friend in Darkness – Slyrr

Best Writer - Mr. Wizard (eligible again at the 7th Annual Fannie Awards)

Additionally, here is a link to the C2C Zaratan started that archives the nominations for the first (and possibly second, but I don't believe so) annual Fannie Awards, which has no less than twenty-six M-rated stories listed.

http://www.fanfiction.net/community/The_Fannie_Awards_Archive/32514/

And finally, from the list of nominations for the Fifth Annual Fannie Awards pinned to the top of this very forum, are the following M-rated stories—again, note the M-rated entry by Zaratan, and all (presumably) allowed by Cpneb, a veteran member of the original Fannie committee, who took on running the Fannies when Zaratan could no longer continue:

3 Best Minor Character Joss Possible, Acting Out, by Sobriety

3 Best Minor Character Moniquity (Monique) (RONMAN THE BARBARIAN) by Mr. Wizard

4 Best Villian Tara from Envy and Ambition by GreenWriterM

8 Best Alternatative Pairing Story Joss Possible and Bonnie Rockwaller, Acting Out by Sobriety.

9 Best KiGo Story Acting out, Sobriety

9 Best KiGo Story Maternal Instinct: Spotlight (Blackbird)

9 Best KiGo Story One Way Or Another by SweetPixieSmile.

12 Best Romance Kim Possible: The Adult Years

14 Best Drama Past and Present by Zaratan

18 Best Series Overall Best Enemies Universe by King in Yellow

23 Best Story Overall Africa, by CloudMonet

23 Best Story Overall Kim Possible: The Adult Years - DeucesWild

A word to the wise: when attempting to revise history, it really is a good idea to make sure no easily accessible records of the true history remain that blatantly contradict your revisionist efforts.

I remember the arguments/debates I had with Zaratan during the Fourth Annual Fannies, and a brief exchange with Cpneb during the Fifth, over the hypocrisy of disallowing the nomination of Adult/NC-17 material under the guise of "Who will think of the children?" protectionism, when he and the original Fannie Awards Committee considered it perfectly acceptable to direct those same Little Johnnies/Janies towards the M-rated nominations on FFN, all potentially containing violence/horror/torture/etc… in line with movies like Aliens / Hostile / The Punisher / Saw series / Terminator / etc… I would not have had those heated arguments/debates with the man if, as you stated, "Mature fics* were not allowed anywhere near the Fannies at all." now would I? The "no Mature fics" rule has always been in reference to general, commonly accepted fan-fiction parlance wherein "Mature" refers to Adult/NC-17 material and the connotations of graphic sex, extreme violence, torture, etc… that go with it, and has never once referred to stories that are or were rated "M" under Fan Fiction dot Net's ratings criteria.

*- as defined by Fan Fiction dot Net's ratings criteria

So, if you want to state that you are revising the criteria for Fannie Award nominations so as to disallow stories rated "M" (under Fan Fiction dot Net's ratings criteria) from this point forward, save for those your Star Chamber deems "acceptable" for submission to the lone newly created category in which you choose to segregate them, that is your right, albeit horribly misguided in my opinion, but do not attempt to act like you are doing everyone an enormous favor by "testing the waters" for general submission of a rating that was always allowed, and do not state that you are simply "upholding the rules as they have always been," because you. are. not.

- Edited to correct multiple formatting errors.

6/25/2011 . Edited 6/26/2011 #23
SHADO Commander

I hope you realize, SHADO, that previously Mature fics were not allowed anywhere near the Fannies at all.

Actually, that's incorrect... which, had you actually read my response was pre-rebutted by the fact that there were at least two M rated winners last year... something that took me about 17 seconds to determine. And, as Lord K has since pointed out, that statement has never been true of any previous Fannies.

If the category causes undue drama we'll simply remove it next year and continue the tradition of disallowing M rated fics.

Er... are you a member of this committee and are the others as equally uninformed? I ask this because when I click on the 'official' link, your name is not mentioned. I see:

KittyPuppy (Kit`Pup/LionKigoWolf) and kgs-wy are handling the Awards Story.

Neo the Saiyan Angel (Drakkimismyship) and Pojko are handing tallying of votes.

And that, of course, begets the question of exactly who else IS on this committee?

6/26/2011 #24
SHADO Commander

As Kit said, this is a test to see the reaction of the Kimmunity overall.

That's correct… although the test would appear to be one to see whether anybody is paying attention to the fact that the rules are being either rewritten or misstated by the new self-elected committee.

Sorry folks, I'm a professional writer and I read every contract thoroughly.

Yes, it's limiting, but please bear in mind that if the test is indeed successful, the Seventh Annual Fannies will begin in less than six months, and may include "M" fictions in general, or in their own categories. There are extenuating circumstances which forced the removal of the "M" category in the past, such as the fact that, at the time the Fannies started, many members of the reading Kimmunity, as well as several authors, were younger than FFN's 'age guidelines' for the "M" category.

This, of course, is a whole series of falsehoods and fallacies, given that said category was obviously never omitted from previous contests, as proven by the multiple M rated winners in previous years, up to and including last year.

With that in mind, we don't take the step of adding in an "M" category, nor thepossiblefuture addition of "M" categories in general lightly. After all, some of the more recent Kimmunity members here on FFN are, indeed, under the age of sixteen.

A ridiculous statement, given that there is no boundary between the Kimmunity and other groups on FFN, nor does excluding M titles in any way keep 'younger members,' who by the terms of joining FFN can be no younger than 13, from reading M rated fiction. At worst, that means we are looking at the difference between a T and an M. With MA not allowed, all other ratings are effectively pointless.

Now, we'd like to point out a comment in our earlier post: "More rules on this will follow in a post following this postst, which will describe the acceptance criteria for "M" fictions and the "vetting process" we will use to make sure it's not pure smut or something that should be on an adult oriented site that somehow slipped past the FFN mods..."

As asked elsewhere, who is conducting this vetting process and what are their qualifications? Moreover, would I be incorrect in presuming that all members of the process automatically agree to give up all eligibility for any Fannie awards in which they are involved, as well as eligibility for any family members?

From every indication we have, the "M" category is a suggested guideline, which apparently holds true even with the FFN Mods. Some of us on the Fannies Committee have seen fictions, both within the KP FFN section, and others, that were blatantly adult material. Not just the motion picture "R" rating, but things that, realistically, would be NC-17 if they were films.

That's a strawman argument at best. You're now saying that the M category should be suspect because someone might misuse it. Well, misuse it in a way other than misstating what the definition of the rating is, as your posts have done repeatedly.

That said, there are many,manyworks that are, in a few words, high quality works of fiction. Works that, unfortunately, fall within the "M" rating category and have, up until this time, been deemed 'unacceptable' to be voted upon within the Fannies.

Yet another restatement of a patent untruth that a child… were they allowed on FFN, which, by the way, they are not… could have noted in just a few minutes. Let me point out again… there were M rated winners in the last Fannies. Have none of you even LOOKED at the lists of previous winners? When was this mythical period where all M titles were banned?

Oh, wait. That's right. It never happened, did it?

Either through the use of language, sexuality or depictions of violence that are just too much for the "T" rating. What this award is for is to give everyone a taste of the high quality works of fiction that are, indeed, available in that rating category.

No, what you're attempting to do is take an entire category that has always been eligible for ALL categories across the board and restrict it to a newly created category. You can repeat your statements and try to bend the truth until you are blue in the face, but you really can't deny the facts as proven by the lists of previous winners.

At this point in time, we're limiting it to one category, and depending on feedback, we will either open the Fannies in general to the "M" rating, or we will add a few more categories to expand the allowed "M" rated fictions to be up for consideration. If feedback prior to the initial voting phase (not nomination phase, mind you) is positive or negative enough, we will either expand with a couple of additional "M" awards for the Sixth Annual Fannies, or we will remove the award category entirely from the main Fannies Awards. Where we go from there will be determined at the point in time it comes to us.

Actually, given that what you are doing is completely against the tone of the original fannies, perhaps it would be best to change the name to something else. And on that subject, could you please not drape the names of deceased members of the Kimmunity around your announcements? I rather doubt they would approve.

And finally we get to the point. We realize it seems as if we're equivocating with all this buildup, and for that we apologize... However, it's important to establish the basics of the rules to follow. The "M" rating is, obviously, a classification of fictions on the site, and thebasequalification for such. In other words, any fic that's listed as "M", for this year's awards, will be up for consideration for that category, as per the rules of FFN.

That said, we know that there's some "M" fics that, upon mature and/or reasoned reflection, may not have needed the "T" rating. There are also some works that, quite bluntly, flaunt FFN's existing "M" rating and slip in something that's decidedly "Adult's Only". We will accept nomination ofanyfiction that's on FFN (or elsewhere, if proper links can be supplied) that is listed as an "M" fic or follows FFN's "M" guideline.

That paragraph should be taken out and shot. First, fics is plural, so it should be there are. Second, "M" fics that, upon mature and/or reasoned reflection, may not have needed the "T" rating doesn't even make sense. Finally, after sentence three states that some M rating tales on FFN are not acceptable, sentence 4 then states that you WILL accept ALL nominations for any fictions that are labeled M anyway? I doubt that's what you meant, but it IS what you wrote.

That brings us to the "Vetting Process" mentioned in our earlier post. The Fannies Committee is just that, acommittee! In the past, there was only one primary member of the Kimmunity putting this award out, occasionally with help, but limited help compared to the totality of the Fannies. We have, at the current time, five primary members, and two volunteers. As we receive "M" rated fics for consideration, we will read them.

Okay, now there are five plus two members of this committee. Again, who are they and what are their qualifications to do this? Any former Fannie winners? I wouldna't argue with a panel lead by, say, Zaratan and Whitem (both who have won fannies for M rated stories, however, and therefore must not exist.)

Those members reading will decide if it's within the general guidelines of the "M" rating, as well as make decisions as to whether or not a given fic violates the rating, whether intentionally or unintentionally; this member will also make notes as to whether or not the fic skirts close to being edge of what is acceptable, and what those moments within the fic are. If it is deemed proper by one reader, than at least one other member will read it, and decide if they agree or disagree, and on what grounds.

Hold on… so what you're actually saying is that only ONE person will read a story and if that person decides the title does meet their qualifications, then means another person had to automatically read it to add a second chance to disqualify it? You don't even have the work-ethic to have a minimum of three people read each story up front?

If they agree, the fiction will be considered nominated, and listed as such. If the second member disagrees, their reasons will be discussed by several members of the Committee, and we will all either read either the whole fiction or (at the very least) the pertinent "questionable' content, and make vote on whether or not it should be considered nominated or declined. If it is declined, we will send a PM or email to the member that nominated it, as well as the author of the fic, with apologies and reasons why it was declined.

Ah... so if that person DOES qualify it, then another person has to read it so that there's a second chance to disqualify it again, and if that person does decide to go negative, the decision then goes to people who don't even have to READ the story? Glad to know you guys are going to be so fair and open minded.

(This was sarcasm.)

This, of course, isn't the best solution,

Of course it isn't. The best solution would be to trust that the existing FFN vetting process works as well as any system can work given that hundreds of different people will have read the story rather than a single person whose job is to be actively looking for a means to disqualify it. Then, rather than submitting each story to what appears to be a shadow council of a handful of people whose presence on FFN's Kimmunity to date seems to be negligible, the processing should actually be done via a series of polls to narrow the nominations down like any other online process. Not only would this be far more reflective of the attitudes of the Kimmunity as a whole, it would also be a lot less work.

but as it stands, it is the most optimal we've discussed. The members of the Fannies Committee are varied in not only their reading tastes, but what they consider 'proper' within a given rating. We are also all quite capable of being as objective as we can, within the bounds of an obviously subjective topic.

And we are supposed to believe this, given that so far you have blatantly attempted to stonewall a series of mistatements and falsehoods so patently obvious that it could be disproved just by looking at the REAL Fannie award community? Sorry, at this point you have absolutely zero credibility.

The goal of the "Vetting Process" is to avoid works that are purely tasteless smut, violence or "shock value". This does not mean, to use just one example, that a descriptive sexual scene that is tasteful will automatically result in the fic being rejected. If, however, the scene or fiction could be considered "excessive", it may result in this happening.

To use two KP specific examples of fictions that have been on FFN for some time, two works by Failte200: "Alone, Together", rated "T" and "Accidental Mistress", rated "M". In "Alone, Together", there were scenes that depicted violence, sexual contact, and even some fairly heavy duty curses. However, taken as a whole, they were, if just barely, considered "T".

Which once again proves that you do not even know what the definition of a T is... let's look at that again:

Suitable for teens, 13 years and older, with some violence, minor coarse language, and minor suggestive adult themes.

There are three major sex scenes in Alone Together, as well as a subtheme of familial molestation. Are you really saying that the title was "barely a T?" You realize that makes it almost a K+ which is

Suitable for more mature childen, 9 years and older, with minor action violence without serious injury. May contain mild coarse language. Should not contain any adult themes.

If anything, this either proves that you have absolutely no idea of what the rating system actually means or that you have no problem with nine year old children reading lesbian sex scenes. While I love Alone Together, it really should have been labeled an M.

In "Accidental Mistress", there were several scenes that were bordering on smut levels of p***, as well as regular use of mature language. However, it all fit, within reason, within the bounds of their given age categories. "Accidental Mistress", were it written (or continued) in 2010, would likely have qualifed.

On the other hand, there have been works of fiction rated "M" that, in all honesty, should not be on FFN, due to rampant, some might say insulting, violation of the rules. Pure smut, aka p*** Without Plot, some of which were rather... Blatant, shall we say? And there are other works that were merely violence for violence's sake, or "gore p***" if you will. We could go on, but we believe our point has been made.

No, the point that has been made, once again, is that you do not even know what the ratings you are trying to use as a guideline mean. You continue to confuse the qualifications of the M rating with the MA. Let's try this one more time…

M: Not suitable for children or teens below the age of 16 with possible strong but non-explicit adult themes, references to violence, and strong coarse language.

MA: Content is only suitable for mature adults. May contain explicit language and adult themes.

To use SHADOO's examples, fictions that have similar scope and quality to the movies he mentioned, such as "The Godfather", would very likely qualify for inclusion in the Fannies.

First, my name is SHADO. Second, my point… which you are either unable to understand or simply never going to acknowledge, is that those films would NOT qualify for anything except Best Mature under this bizarro version of the Fannies you are attempting to pass off as the real thing.

Because… this is getting tiring of having to repeat it… the same facets that gave the film an R would also require it to be labeled an M in the fan fic world. After all, the violence, language and more mature themes were not presented as smut, "gore p***" or the like, but were part of a flowing, integrated whole, but targeted at an obviously more mature audience.

Which is what the M designates! How hard is it to understand that Mature does NOT equal explicit sex.

Overall, our goal is not to limit the "M" rated works of fiction that follow the "hard and fast" rules of the rating, but which, in the opinions of the Kimmunity and the Committee, are worthy of recognition due to high quality. But please try to keep in mind, we have to try and make the awards as "family friendly" as possible,

Okay, first, who designated you the voice of the opinions of the Kimmunity? I never voted for you. Did anyone? Maybe the first thing that should be done is that each member of the committee should submit a resume to the Kimmunity as a whole for vetting. This may be difficult, given that some of you don't seem to have done very much here, but beyond that

Why?

No, seriously, why an emphasis on "family friendly?"

I mean, you DO realize that no one under the age of 13 is even allowed to access FFN, right? So the worst violation that is possible as long as everyone is following the rules is for someone who should only be eligible to read a T sneaking over and reading some thing intended for an age group that is exactly three years older.

Or are the members of this committee suggesting that they aren't following the rules and have family members under the age of 13 they are allowing free access to FFN?

And let's not even get into the fact that fan fics are a technically illegal past time, sogetting the whole family together to perpetrate violation of copyright isn't exactly the kind of activity that's condoned by Better Family Living, is it?

while, more importantly in our opinion, recognizing those works as the Kimmunity, even those of the "M" rating. And in the future, we hope that, perhaps, we may indeed have "M" rated fics along side lower ratings, or voted on in parallel within the Fannies Awards, as the case may be, depending on the opinion of the Kimmunity as a whole.

Oh, I agree the opinion of the Kimmunity as a whole is what's most important here. And with that said, it would seem that the first step to making sure this is all done properly and WITH the overall consensus of the community as a whole is for all of those who wish to be on "the comittee" to publically submit themselves and their qualifications to the Kimmunity as a whole for vetting as to whether we think they are capable of thinking for the Kimmunity as a whole.

Or do you consider it unreasonable to subject yourselves to the same kind of summary judgement that you're so eager to carry out as part of your own agendas?

6/26/2011 #25
ThePlagueBeast

Since all of you seem so determined to sink the ship that is the Fannies, I'm jumping off. Goodbye, good luck, and I hope you're proud of yourselves.

6/26/2011 #26
AmericanGecko

Since all of you seem so determined to sink the ship that is the Fannies, I'm jumping off. Goodbye, good luck, and I hope you're proud of yourselves.

Kit, I understand your frustration, but I don't think leaving is the answer.

Honestly, I feel the issue should be put to a vote--perhaps a mod could set up a poll?

A.G.

6/26/2011 #27
SHADO Commander

Since all of you seem so determined to sink the ship that is the Fannies, I'm jumping off. Goodbye, good luck, and I hope you're proud of yourselves.

Gosh, how strange that standing up for keeping the Fannies as they've always been, rather than letting the established rules get run over rough shod and re-written by people who've either never taken the time to look at the existing history while spewing a wide wake of easily disproved fallacies to cover major changes they were attempting to sneak in translates into "trying to sink the ship."

6/26/2011 #28
ThePlagueBeast

I did not see anyone else stepping up to fill in the shoes. And don't YOU DARE ACCUSE ME OF NOT RESPECTING THE FANNIES.

YOU A**.

I don't care how this looks. I am SICK AND TIRED OF BEING TOLD I AM DOING THINGS WRONG WHEN NO ONE ELSE IS DOING THEM AT ALL.

So if you love being in charge so DAMN much, you take over! I am out! I hope you are satisfied. And I hope I never see your face on the internet again.

GOOD. BYE.

6/26/2011 #29
Neo the Saiyan angel

SHADO, we just wanted to make sure that it was obvious to everyone that the old rule was going to be tested to make sure everyone was okay with it being gone. It REALLY WAS a rule that there would be no mature stories. I actually thought that the Best Mature was a good idea to test the water and let whoever had objections make them. Democratic stuff and all. Would you have preferred us to outright drop the rule?

And yes, we did notice the discrepancies between the rule and the results. It was disheartening to me seeing as how that was such an enormous argument a few years ago.

6/26/2011 #30
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