HomeGirls, HomeBoys, and HomeGenderOptionals
A place for fans of 'Home' to converge and discuss pretty much anything about the film, TOS, and of course, Kirk and Spock. Story ideas and recommendations, musings on characterizations, requests, all are welcome. The only thing disallowed is poker.
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Lanaea

As per terriestal-angell's suggestion, here's a new topic for LanceSkoggle's effort to create a substantial fan-movement towards getting the writers of the next Star Trek film to stop being jerks about slash. They don't realize the potential gold-mine they're sitting on if they actually work with us, rather than against us. Let's convince them that insecure conservatives do not, in fact, make up the majority of paying Trek fans!

Exerpt From Lance's Original Post:

ALSO! This is an ATTN to everyone! I have been considering this idea for the past few weeks while reading "Home," and seeing how powerful the relationship between Kirk and Spock can be. There is actually a way that we can have our voices heard, and attempt to influence the future of Kirk/Spock from beyond the internet community. At this moment, the writers are in delicate stages of crafting the story for the second film, due for release in 2011. The script, from what I've read, is due at the end of this year, and they plan to begin shooting next summer. We as a collective fan base have the opportunity to let our voices be heard and finally get some real Kirk and Spock love on screen. Now, I know that what I am proposing is a very, very, very long shot, but bare with me, and if you would like, just amuse me for a mere moment. Also keep in mind that I am open to suggestions and different thoughts, or a complete shut down if I've become slightly crazy. Since, as stated, the story of nuTrek2 is in delicate stages of drafting, we have the unique and rare opportunity to let the writers know, who mind you, have stated that they are open to suggestions from fans (we are indeed fans, aren't we?) and let the studio know, that we are tired of living in the dark. Now keep in mind, we're not asking for long sex/love/make-out scenes between our favorite intergalactic couple (although that would not be objectionable of course). We're asking for that love connection to be acknowledged in the films. We're asking for a chance, and a shot to be heard. For too long science fiction has excluded homosexual characters and parings from canon (save a few, such as the recent Torchwood, but that's the BBC). Something unique and respectable that Gene Roddenberry did is that he left that particular question open to interpretation. This was at a time when a homosexual relationship between any characters simply could not be done. Star Trek has always pushed the envelope as far as social equality is concerned, and I see no reason for this to stop now. We are at a unique time when it IS possible see a homosexual relationship on screen, and I think it is suffice to say that in the particular spirit of Gene Roddenberry, it is time to push the envelope further and further into social justice. This is also a sensitive time in the gay community - we are having difficulties everywhere, but progress is being made. I think that a huge film like Star Trek, produced by J.J. et al has the potential to make a huge splash all around the board, and it would be a message of hope to not only the gay community, but to social-minded people everywhere that there is hope in our race (another huge theme of the Trek series). There is hope that in the future a gay paring could exist in the 23rd century and be living in peace, openly and freely. This would be our contention. Now? How can we let the writers, producers, and studio know that this is something that we want? It's actually fairly simple, although if someone knows someone who knows someone, et cetera, that'd be easier, because then we could just pass along a message. But if not, the solution is, as I've said, simple. A viral campaign. We should be spreading our ideas via word of mouth, and through social networking sites, not to mention other Star Trek communities. Facebook groups, Twitter, YouTube (video blogs, ect), blogs and other sites can all be used to spread this idea quickly. In this way, if there is a good amount of committed individuals out there, we can raise awareness of this idea, which could eventually escalate into it getting back to the producers, writers, et al. We can also start an online petition, that would hopefully give us an idea of the number of people who want this, and could serve as another viral campaign strategy. Also, word of mouth is another key to success. If you talk to your friends/neighbors/lovers/brothers/what-have-you, anyone who will listen, it is possible for information to spread that way as well. It would take some considerable effort and a dedicated amount of time, but it could be done. And the result? At worst, an acknowledgment and a statement by the writers/producers to slash fans about why they do not intend to delve into this particular subject matter. At best? A steamy kiss between our favorite half-Vulcan and Captain. It could work. If enough of us gather our torches and march, someone will eventually notice, pardon the metaphor. What use is it to sit back and complain about what they are doing when we can directly impact it? Let's not sit back at our computers and be passive and watch as these movies go by. Also, to add to this, I believe "Home," if allowed by Lanaea, of course, could be a point of contention and reference to how a relationship could develop between these two characters, and why it is so powerful. I think that is just a tribute to her work. I realize that this is a long post, but if anyone has any ideas or would like to contribute to this cause in anyway, let me know. My brain has been at work for a few weeks on this, and I think that this is an awesome opportunity to actually DO something for a change. Again, if anyone has any ideas, or wants to shut me down before I go off the deep end with this, just let me know. I want to know other people's thoughts and ideas. If you've read all of this post, thanks for reading it and staying with me. Also, thank you to Lanaea for making a forum, and just generally facilitating awesomeness all around.

---

So, do what you can to help get our voices heard, and post about it or make suggestions for it here! It would probably help to construct some reasonable arguments to start passing around about why slash = money. After all, that's what the business is about, in the end, so that's the most likely argument to have an impact.

Personally, I think this is a long shot, but that if we're anything like the good captain, we've got to take that one in a million chance that it just might work.

6/30/2009 #1
Me Or The Wallpaper

I for one think that it would be brilliant to find some kind of middle ground- like, for instance, if in the new movie as apposed to trying very, very hard to make it almost anti-suggestion-of-K/S, they could try to have what was in the Original series, which was, as Roddenbury said, 'deep love undertones.'

As for people thinking it's a longshot, this is my view:

Star Trek when it came out was filled with things that no one expected to see on television, ludicrus ideas like black women who weren't maids and interracial kisses and world peace. In this day and age having a black and white person kiss on television is done all the time and most people don't even think about it. Having two men or two women kiss however... well, that's just today's version of what was considered crazy then.

The biggest thing that Star Trek did originally was show a world that was more accepting generally than the one we lived in. If the people writing the new movie want to do that same thing, wouldn't this be exactly the way to do it? We are basically in the same kind of situation here. Back then, people thought it was insane to have a black woman and a white man kiss on screen. Now, people are saying it would be crazy for two men to do so.

So yeah. If these writers are really fans of Star Trek, and I'm thinking they must at least be fans to be, you know, writing the new movies, there's a chance that they might want to continue the Star Trek tradition of neglecting social norms in an attempt to bring the real world closer to the social utopia depicted.

6/30/2009 #2
Dreamera Tear

Whee! Thanks for creating the topic Lanaea! Erm, I don't really have anything substantial to say now since I need to sleep and get charged for my Chemistry paper tomorrow, so I'm sorry about the really off-topic post. But hopefully, we'll get to see more action here, and finally actually be able to make a difference for the next ST! Cheers!

6/30/2009 #3
Me Or The Wallpaper

One of the issues has to be that they feel they'd loose money by showing a sign of support for gay rights.

However...

This says that the majority of Americans actually support gay marriage. So they in all likelihood would probably gain a few hundred fans as apposed to loose many (they would loose some, admittedly) because people would want to see a movie that was about something else and still contained any kind of romantic love between members of the same sex. I mean, the only huge movies right now that contain homosexual couples are about homosexual couples. This would simply be Star Trek crossing another social barrier in another time, like I said. And this suggests that they wouldn't really suffer for it at all anyway.

6/30/2009 #4
Me Or The Wallpaper

One of the issues has to be that they feel they'd loose money by showing a sign of support for gay rights.

However...

This says that the majority of Americans actually support gay marriage. So they in all likelihood would probably gain a few hundred fans as apposed to loose many (they would loose some, admittedly) because people would want to see a movie that was about something else and still contained any kind of romantic love between members of the same sex. I mean, the only huge movies right now that contain homosexual couples are about homosexual couples. This would simply be Star Trek crossing another social barrier in another time, like I said. And this suggests that they wouldn't really suffer for it at all anyway.

6/30/2009 #5
Me Or The Wallpaper

...whoops. Didn't mean to do that, sorry. ^_^'

6/30/2009 #6
Target23

That's okay! Just in case somebody didn't hear you the first time.

6/30/2009 #7
LanceSkoggle

Hello everyone! It's a lovely morning to start a grand scheme concerning getting our favorite half-Vulcan into bed with the captain. This should be fun.

@Lanaea, Thanks for creating the new topic and the support! I'm so happy that I have it. If you don't mind, and obviously you do not have to do this, but would you mind advertising this idea in one of your author's notes? Because I feel like a substantial amount of people would flock here. If not there, maybe your profile? I'd just like to get as many people on board with this initially as possible. On money: In my personal opinion, one big thing about the sex appeal of Star Trek is the men. A very large amount of women go to see Trek because of the really, really good looking men in the film. I think this would just be the icing on the cake for them. And the thing is, they do not have to just have K/S. They can develop other relationships as well. I think they could still include K/S and still manage to "put something in for everyone." So on K/S = money, K/S also = women and girls. Lots and lots of women and girls. Also, this would attract a large amount of the gay community, who will also bring a substantial amount of money. The only backlash of course would be if the people over at FoxNews, such as our good friend Bill O'Rilley, or any other conservative started calling for a boycott on the film. But the thing is, in my opinion, Women + Pre-established Trek fans who wouldn't miss a movie for the world + LGBT Community + Socially-Minded People is greater than the force of hypothetical Conservative Boycotters. Just saying. On being like the captain. I really, really like this idea. I think it would be in the spirit of Captain Kirk to at least try!

So, with that thought in mind, I wanted to open the floor up to suggestions on a unified name for this viral campaign. I think we need something catchy, that will make eyebrows raise, and gain curiosity. At this moment, I don't have any names, but I'm working on it. Also, themes, slogans, ect should all be considered at this point!

I will probably create an e-mail, facebook, myspace, twitter, and youtube account for this project. But I need a name first to do so, and some more support and ideas. One idea I had is to create on YouTube the meat of the message that would contain the formal request. We could also post it all over places, such as the petition (which would happen), and on Facebook groups, ect. I also had an idea to do maybe like a weekly video blog that would update everyone on our efforts, and also be an opportunity to have some fun, advertising other works of fiction and such. Also, I will probably create a website that will have the bulk of information and links to all the accounts and ideas. I'm still open to suggestions on this front.

@Me Or the Wallpaper, I see your point about creating a middle-ground. The thing is about our suggestion is is that they can use it how they see best fit. I'm not saying we yell and demand a steamy make-out scene, I just say we demand that they acknowledge the love we all know is canon. And I agree with what you said of a social utopia. I know the first goal of course of any writer is to just create good material. They just want to make a good movie. But on top of that, it would be nice if we could get substantial social progress, and I think in the spirit of Gene Roddenberry, it would be foolish not to. And on the article: I totally agree with what you're saying. One problem I have with many films that have gay characters is that they make it all about gay issues. And these movies are not bad movies; Milk is a wonderful film, for example. But I think it would be nice to actually see a same-gender couple on screen, but not have the entire film be about gay rights or problems. It would just be one more element to the show.

@terriestral-angell, Haha. Get some sleep and come back with a clear head full of ideas!

Thanks for the support guys. I'll be around here scheming, so anyone with ideas, let me know! ^_^

6/30/2009 . Edited 6/30/2009 #8
Me Or The Wallpaper

Dear god, we're going to have a slogan now? XD That is so perfect! I can't wait to see what it is!

It should probably, as you said, raise a few eyebrows, but let's not go too far. We want people who aren't fans of slash to like this too. XD

6/30/2009 #9
LanceSkoggle

Well, I figure that any sort of viral campaign needs something to catch attention. If we really want to get the ball rolling on this, we need as much support as we can get. I'm just trying to brainstorm ideas to push this to the next level. And on going too far: I think this is actually a really important point. The point is not to harass or raise a huge ruckus, but to create a buzz that will be poignant enough to reach the ears of the studio.

6/30/2009 #10
xxHypocrisy

Why not call it like it is? The K/S Mainstream Effort?

Hmm...perhaps that's a little bit much?

Star Trek Social Equality Effort? I like the word effort...and Mainstream too, actually, but it sounds funny in teh middle of it.

Meh. ^^

6/30/2009 #11
bakedbrownie

I'll make sure to go post around a bit too about all of this. Things are getting exciting!

6/30/2009 #12
Me Or The Wallpaper

I don't think we should put K/S in it, because then it seems more like we're asking for a pairing. Star Trek Social Equality Effort sounds more like what I'm working for.

Hm. STSEE. Stacy. o_O I'll have to remember to tell her that. Anyway-

Any other ideas? My mind's basically drawing a blank here.

6/30/2009 #13
LanceSkoggle

Well, I'll just go ahead and list off some random ideas that have been floating around my brain:

Trek for Equality (e-trek or something)

The Cranberry Project (Home reference XD -- couldn't resist)

SEE is actually a good idea. You could say SEE Trek or SEE Love. (SEE being Social Equality Effort).

logical!love (another random idea that popped into my head).

Project GoBold

23 is LOVE (reference to the 23rd century)

These are just some ideas to kick start some more brainstorming.

I wanting to start building the website and making the viral campaign happen within the next few days, because we need to get the word out.

Some ideas for the website:

Do you guys think it would be productive to have a forum for the website? I'm thinking it could help the flow of communication, and unify it some. Especially on ideas and such.

Tonight I'm going to write a rough draft for the petition -- so if any one has any ideas for this on what to say exactly that would be great. I need something concise and to the point. Also, I want this project to be very minimalist so that someone does not have to take up a lot of their time to get involved.

So quick ways to get involved would be:

Sign the petition. Talk about it. Spread the love. (this could be a slogan of some kind -- Sign. Talk. Spread).

If I start a video blog like I probably will, with a formal recorded message to the producers, I will also need help in what to say there concisely, and as least offensive as possible.

Also, if I start an e-mail account for this, which I will since I don't want to use my personal inbox for potential flames, ect, I will also probably use that inbox to publicly advertise to the producers on where to send their statements if they find this, and feel so led.

Also, if anyone is into graphic design and stuff like that, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE let me know. It would be a huge help to have a few graphics to put up on the website.

I really would like to get this going and launch this within the next week or so, so I need help! Please! Thank you!

6/30/2009 . Edited 6/30/2009 #14
xxHypocrisy

SEE is good, you could come up with some cool slogans for it and the symbols could be an eye or something. With the Federation symbol for a pupil. lulz.(maybe?)

Having a forum would be a very good idea, that way there would be one place where everyone who supports/doesn't support it could gather to chat/complain about it. I can draw pretty decently, I also have a coloring program on the computer so I could try my hand at making a couple graphics. It would take me a day or two though to make them look nice.

Once we have a name and perhaps a logo then I can make something. (A slogan too, perhaps.)

6/30/2009 #15
xczdf

d

6/30/2009 . Edited 6/8/2011 #16
Me Or The Wallpaper

While Home is definitely brilliant (kudos to Lanea yet again for bringing it into the world) I don't think we should base the entire idea on one fanfiction. Trek for Equality is alright, but it seems a bit bland. SEE Trek sounds really good though, definitely kind of catchy. Project GoBold is also good, though I think we should have one that references both what wonderfully nerdy show we're all loving and our ideas, so SEE Trek is still my personal favorite. And while logical!love is cute, I still think SEE Trek is probably the best.

As for the website, it should definitely have a forum. With a moderator though, someone who could delete particularly horrible comments. And definitely a curse word blocker that blocks the word faggot. o_O Just thinking ahead here, peeps.

By the way, when you start the youtube channel, I would recomend trying to get the support of these brothers called 'The Nerdfighters.' There was actually a link to one of their videos posted on the other thread. They're really wildly popular, given that they're hilarious, talk about real issues and nerdy sci fi and fantasy stuff, and the one brother John Green is a semi-famous writer with some brilliant work. To be honest, something like this sounds right up their alley.

If you were to get their support enough that one of them would do a video about it themselves with a link to your video, or even if you simply uploaded your video as a response to one of their own addressing gay rights or something like that, you'd probably get quite a few people supporting this right off the bat. I mean, they literally have 90,652 subscribers, and you can be sure that virtually all of their subscribers support gay rights and that ALL of them are simply wonderfully nerdy. Sounds kind of promising to me. :-D Just a thought.

6/30/2009 . Edited 6/30/2009 #17
xczdf

c:

6/30/2009 . Edited 6/8/2011 #18
LanceSkoggle

Hey again. I'm glad that there is a few who are supporting this off the bat, and I do agree that it'll be best to hit the ground running with a solid stream of base supporters. Also, since I have no life, I think I'm going to go ahead and devote this to be my summer project, and anyone willing to devote substantial amounts of time to help me from going crazy would be much appreciated.

I'm still waiting on responses, but I really do like the idea of SEE. It is catchy. SEE Trek would be pretty cute, and it makes a lot of sense. Also, it has a fabulous pun in it. ^_^

I did have an idea that could correlate with SEE. One YouTube video could be a trailer of sorts that would support this idea that would read (and say): "SEE. SEE Spock. SEE Spock Love. SEE Spock Love Kirk." Or something to that effect. XD

@xxHypocricy, Sounds awesome. Do you have a sample of your work that I can SEE? XD -- I'm very interested.

@ MrEccentric, Yay! I'm glad I have your support. By the way, I love your art! It's very cute. Do you think you could do some drawings for this project? I don't know in what capacity, but if you have any ideas, let me know. Prop 8 was, and still is a huge upset. And I don't want this to get too political yet, but I will say this: you are not being naive. Yes, the world is full of evil, but if there was no one to combat that evil and keep it from becoming too crazy, what would happen? Don't listen to anyone who tells you you can't do something about it. You can. It doesn't have to be big things. It can be something as simple as explaining your beliefs to someone, or just giving them a hug and demonstrating the power of love to others. This is something I firmly believe in: action in little actions. Who knows, maybe we can be comparable to Frodo trekking (pardon the pun) his way up to Mount Doom -- nerdtastic reference notwithstanding. You keep being awesome.

@Me or the Wallpaper, I understand where you are coming from. There will be a certain amount of diligence that needs to be practiced -- and censors on the forums will be a definite. Also, I know of the Nerdfighters, and I have several friends who are Nerdfighters, and I would be very interested in enlisting their support. Do you have any ideas about how we can go about this? Gosh, I'm so excited by that idea. This is what I love about viral campaigns -- a strategy I learned from our current president: you create a buzz by going where the people are. The idea that 1 person becomes 10, 10 becomes 100, 100 becomes 1000, 1000 becomes 100,000 and so on is a very exciting prospect, and I think there is ALOT of potential there.

ALSO! Anyone that knows of popular websites and blogs (Star Trek related or LGBT related or anything really), let me know, because I would love to get in touch with as many groups as possible. ANYTHING you can do to help, yes, yes, yes!

Guys. I'm so excited. You have no idea.

6/30/2009 #19
Alora Sky

Hahahah! I loved that idea! I want to be part of Project GoBold, SEE, or Logically!Love! That would be awsome. I vote fro Project GoBold, sees to say "Trek" more than the others (just looking at the words alone).

6/30/2009 #20
Me Or The Wallpaper

For getting Nerdfighter support, I think they'd like it enough if you just made a good enough video and put it as a response to be honest. I remember one of them mentioning at one point loving the video responses, so I think it's the only way to make sure they actually see it. It'd have to be one that would hold their attention though, and it would probably be better while talking to them to stress how this would be a great support of Roddenburry and his ideals and of putting a homosexual relationship into mainstream stuff. It would probably also be better to show (briefly) how Kirk/Spock was shown in TOS. I vote for The Backrub Scene- it certainly has the advantage of being short and funny. But we probably shouldn't get too caught up in actual fan support of the pairing itself, we're striving for something bigger and all that.

We should make a banner for putting on the Star Trek or LGBT blogs and stuff.

For anyone who doesn't know, this is The Backrub Scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNZt-9Afdi4

I also think they'd probably like "SEE. SEE Spock. SEE Spock Love. SEE Spock Love Kirk." XD You should totally get some images for each of those sentences.

6/30/2009 #21
xczdf

:o

6/30/2009 . Edited 6/8/2011 #22
aohatsu

I'm in! I highly doubt that we'll get a kiss--it's way too big of a risk for a big company to take, I think, on the second movie of what could be a series, when they're not entirely positive of the response they'd get. But the higher we aim, the higher we'll go!

In the first movie, Spock and Jim hardly had any interaction that wasn't clouded by them disliking each other, or the epic battle that they were fighting, but in this new, second movie, they're going to have to write in a budding relationship starting to resemble that of the relationship they had in the original series--which even they have to admit, was way beyond a regular 'watch football and drink beer after work' friendship. They can't really avoid it, so of course the smart thing to do would be to add in some of the low-key flirtations we've always gotten. Even without the fans intervention, I'm positive we'll get some of that. After all, neither character is likely to just itell/i us that they really like the other, now are they? It'll be in the small hints of their interactions.

So, I don't think we'll be getting any kissing--but friendly touching, maybe? Let's aim high though, and if it doesn't pull through for the second movie, there's always the third!

Also, does anyone else think J.J. Abrams reading 'Home' would be the most fantastic thing ever? XD

6/30/2009 #23
xczdf

:D

6/30/2009 . Edited 6/8/2011 #24
zyll10

Ironically, I just blogged about this.

I think it's a very-- logical idea, and I'm in to help in any way I can.

6/30/2009 #25
Dreamera Tear

I'm home after my paper! RAWR! I can probably talk to the people in my forum about it as well and see how they react - but I think most of the people there are more for HET pairings instead so -_-" I'll probably talk to people in the yahoo groups I frequent about it too. Maybe we can ask those who have el-jay accounts to go talk to the peeps in stxi kink meme about itXD I'm sure most of the people there will definitely support this! XD

I'll probably have to say I don't want to see anything too explicit coz I think Star Trek and what it represents definitely should be something that even the younger generation can watch. Maybe like what some other shows have, I think the term for it is bromance? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think even that would make me quite happy already. XD

6/30/2009 . Edited 6/30/2009 #26
Crazy Like A Fawkes

This whole idea is brilliant. You guys have my support! Once you figure out a name, I think it would be a good idea to make some sort of logo, slogan, or icons that people could put on their profile. If you need me, my photoshop skills are at your disposal.

6/30/2009 #27
Lanaea

Referenced the movement in an author's note. Probably link to it on my profile later. Gonna go die for now. Love you guys!

6/30/2009 #28
mikkiness

YES! this is an incredible idea. Heck, the only reason I even saw the movie was because I'd heard about the k/s undertones in the old stuff. If it was actually in there for real every single slasher on the planet would watch it whether they liked it or not to show their support. Oh, and a random slogan idea, maybe something along the lines of 'the Good Spork' or something because normally when you spork yourself it's because it's a bad thing and in this case its not. I dunno just a random thought. I don't think talking to my ates will help the cause much though, I'm a New Zealander and very used to the fact that no one cares about whats happening in a tiny country at the bottom of the globe. What ever, I'll try anyway, if nothing else it'll underscore the fact that people all over they world want this so bad.

6/30/2009 #29
Rosiekins

I was just thinking about this! I've been watching TOS for the first time (and the older movies) and WOW, S/K was more than subversive. The time is right to acknowledge their relationship. EVERYBODY would want to see it, even people who were against it, I wager. It would be huge.

Yes, we must make this happen!

6/30/2009 #30
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