HomeGirls, HomeBoys, and HomeGenderOptionals
A place for fans of 'Home' to converge and discuss pretty much anything about the film, TOS, and of course, Kirk and Spock. Story ideas and recommendations, musings on characterizations, requests, all are welcome. The only thing disallowed is poker.
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@Me Or The Wallpaper: Agreed. I think if we can incorporate symbols that are already associated with GLBT rights/equality, also, might be a good avenue.

How about working with GLBT agencies? This is primarily a social issue, after all, not a slash fangirl issue. :)

7/1/2009 #91
Pirate College Graduate

They're planning a love-triangle in the second film? Officially? Oh boy, if so, I can't say that makes me feel thrilled. Kirk didn't seem too jealous of Spock during all the Spock/Uhura moments in the first one. Now, on the other-hand, if he was jealous of Uhura... XD


PS: Also at Mikkiness, wow, I didn't even THINK of that. During all that time she touches him he HAD to have experienced her emotions and such. Wonder what that did to him.

7/1/2009 . Edited 7/1/2009 #92
eccentric sunshine

@mikkiness: I agree with you that Uhura wasn't exactly an emotional anchor for Spock. But I also do not think it was lust that propelled her to go after Spock into the turbolift. Her sadness and intention were sincere, even if her actions were a little too touchy-feely. It might have been her female/maternal instinct, but I feel she should haven known better than to crowd Spock like that.

@Pirate College Graduate: I didn't know they were planning a triangle either. And yes, it would be less than ideal if they do execute that idea.

7/1/2009 . Edited 7/1/2009 #93
Me Or The Wallpaper

SolarCat: From what I gather, you're worried that us drawing attention to this would reflect negatively on the fanbase in general, and basically make fanfiction for Star Trek illegal.

You mentioned Anne Rice-

Anne Rice cannot sue people for writing about her characters unless they are making a profit. Fanfiction dot net does not allow people to post stories for her stories because she requested it. I'm not entirely sure on all the details involving the request, but I do know that if I printed up a bunch of fanfiction stories I wrote for one of Anne Rice's books and put a single sentence dislcaimer in the front saying 'So, yeah, Anne Rice made these characters.' or something, or even if I didn't put a disclaimer, and starting handing them out on street corners, there is nothing anyone could do to stop me. It's the same for Star Trek. At worst, and trust me, I don't think this'll happen, J.J. Abrams or someone will request that fanfiction dot net not have a section for Star Trek, and then there'll be other websites that will and stories will end up there instead. But I really, really don't think they'd try to limit something that feeds the obsessions of some of their fans.

Another thing you pointed out was that they're kind of idols like Superman and everything, so people wouldn't want them to be gay-- nothing against your opinion or anyone elses, but isn't that kind of exactly what we're working at? Sure, it doesn't exactly have the finest chances of working out, but we're still trying. This is what I personally meant. Get a homosexual relationship into something mainstream and don't make the movie entirely about it. Hell, I wouldn't even want them to kiss in the movie as a fan, because I don't like it when movies focus more on the romance than the action and general plot. I'd just want the hints like in the show, only perhaps a little more pronounced since this isn't, as we've mentioned, the sixties. What allot of people seem to be missing is that in the sixties, all the stuff that was done in Star Trek that showed equality such as black women in power and the interacial kiss seemed crazy and risky then. I personally am asking for the 21st century version (or at least coming close, I mean seriously) of that kiss.

And... just a moment to break friendly arguing and just be a fan...

What?! o_O I don't hate Uhuru! She's freaking awesome!! Who hates Uhuru? I mean, I don't exactly like her with Spock, but that's just because I'm a slave to the canon, man. Like, I would want her to be one of the main characters instead of just 'The Love Interest' in the next movie.

I also agree with Lanea on the whole 'specifying' thing- and I'm reading this bit by bit and then editing my post, so sorry if I bring up things already addressed, I just don't want a line of five posts down of me contradicting myself- I actually worried myself that they'd just make a gay red shirt, but then I also had the worry that they'd just thrown the gay characters- acting utterly stereotypical, I might add- in for a moment before dying and having them not really impact the plot at all, just like Lanea said. Now. Time to read. All. Those. Posts. Future changes to this post coming-

Ok. Sulu/Chekov... it's cute and everything, but it has no canon base whatsoever. Not that that stops the movie producers, but still. If we're going to argue for something, we should argue for something with a some form of solid ground to stand on.

7/1/2009 . Edited 7/1/2009 #94
Lyrical Rex

@mikkiness: Oh yeah, they're touch telepathic, huh. But I don't agree with the lust part. That would be incredibly insensitive of Uhura to send the message that she wants to jump his bones at that juncture in time, which looking back on the scene, it could definitely be interpreted that way. And damn, you're right about the alternative about having a chaste kiss and hug too. But Uhura obviously felt that being as close as possible would be beneficial, and probably woud have been to her if not Spock. She obviously overlooked the Vulcan way of dealing with emotion or tried to subvert it, which proves a definite dysfunction in their relationship.

@Pirate College Grad: Uhm, I'm probably guilty of throwing the Kirk/Uhura/Spock love-triangle idea around. To me, it seems as if it is already intentionally set up, and somewhere (I'm not sure if it was an online article or an interview or WHERE) I picked up a line about the triangle. Because Hollywood cannot stand to NOT have a love interest involved with the hero somewhere, Kirk's pursuit of Uhura will likely continue. Of course, I don't agree entirely, partially because it makes Uhura more of a symbol than a character, and mostly because she will get in the way of Kirk and Spock's relationship development.

7/1/2009 #95

I just thought I'd quickly mention that the idea floating around about a K/U/S triangle was hinted at by Chris Pine in several interviews. He basically says "you're going to get a taste of the triangle in [Star Trek], but not a full meal," insinuating that it will continue on in the sequel.

@mikkiness, that idea was hilarious. You should make it into a fic. ^_^

7/1/2009 #96
Pirate College Graduate

Lance: What exactly does the whole "taste but not full meal" aspect of it mean? I know overall it means there will probably be a triangle (which we can try and push into ending up being K/S!) but I don't get that specific part of it. Does that mean it won't be a main issue in the next film?

Also, how does Chris know this already? I thought the script for the second film was still in its very early stages.

Hope I don't sound like a smartass. Just a curious fan. :)


7/1/2009 #97

*waves hello* Lurker here! I just wanted to mention something regarding Uhura's characterization and/or pairing. Tread carefully. I personally feel that there was a lot of wasted potential in the movie version of Uhura but not everyone agrees, and going down that route has the potential to be more divisive that persuasive. I think this thread (which is wavering on the line between discussion and wank, IMO) over at the st_xi_kink meme is a good demonstration of how polarizing bringing that issue up could be:

7/1/2009 #98

Whoops! Sorry about the double post. FF.net's forum is funky O.o FYI to those of you unfamiliar to this setup - clicking the back button after you've posted sends the information to post a second time.

7/1/2009 #99


Not precisely. It's not like they can make Trek fic specifically "illegal" in the sense of making a law that would ban it. Nobody is going to waste time or money on that. But as far as stopping you; yes, they can. They can issue a DMCA takedown notice, they can take you to court. They can argue copyright infringement if they like--they may or may not win, since you're not making any money, but they can afford more lawyers than you can. The creators can charge defamation and tie you up in a legal battle that will likely end with you bankrupt, unless you're independently wealthy. They don't need to win the case. HOWEVER, I AM NOT SAYING THAT THEY WOULD DO ANY OF THIS. They want to avoid that as much as you do, in fact, because that would be a lot of bad publicity. Yes, this is the nightmare scenario, and you can pretty much count on it not happening, at least given the relatively-friendly relationships between fans and the PTB nowadays.

The thing is, copyright is very, very touchy and very complicated. As I've stated in earlier posts, the status quo is one of, roughly, tacit noninterference. I am not saying the world will end and fandom will be illegal if we break that status quo. I will suggest that there are a lot of very devoted people with plenty of legal experience who are working to break the status quo in a way that will hopefully end happily for fandom (that would be the Organization for Transformative Works, which I've mentioned previously). They are going about this slowly and carefully because they know all the ways it could end badly and would very much like to avoid those ends.

Drawing attention to the fans' desire to see homosexual relationships portrayed positively in their fandoms? Is awesome. But it needs to be done the right way, with respect for fannish culture and social norms (i.e., respect for your fellow fans) and respect for the writers and producers and actors who create the texts we're interacting with. You have to be willing to look at the creators' perspective and understand the constraints they work under (pressure from the studios and the production companies that finance the films and are looking almost exclusively at the bottom line, pressure from legions of fans to remain true to the original franchise while also bringing something fresh and new and interesting to the table, constraints of time and budget and the MPAA, constraints in the actors' contracts, etc etc etc). And then you have to take all of this knowledge and perspective and look at what you're asking for, and ask yourself if it's reasonable. And if it is, then you need to approach the PTB rationally and calmly and open a dialogue, and be prepared to step back gracefully if they say, "Sorry, no." If you go about things thoughtfully, politely, rationally and calmly, you have a better chance of success, and a much lower chance of whatever you're doing backfiring on you in the event of failure.

(Next point!)

In a way, it's what we're working at. Allowing characters to be gay or lesbian without it being The Issue Of The Plot is certainly a big goal, especially in mainstream media franchises and so on. But my point about Kirk and Spock's status in the cultural consciousness runs a little deeper than the amount to which public opinion on homosexuality has shifted since the 60s. Much like Superman and other high-status cultural objects, people have an emotional connection to these characters, whether they know it or not. If the next Star Trek positioned Kirk and Spock as homosexual lovers? You would be surprised at the number of people who would suddenly care, and not like it. It's not, no joke intended here, logical. When Superman "died" it made national newspaper headlines. That's a comic book character. But an iconic one, and one that has a lot of collective memory and symbolism built up around him. Kirk and Spock occupy a similar place in American popular culture and our cultural consciousness (as well as a place of near-if-not-outright reverence in the history of SF/F). There are already sections of Trek fandom and of the mainstream culture who are upset at the degree to which J.J. took liberties with Trek canon and changed backstories and so on. The outcry against an explicitly homosexual relationship between the two would be tremendous, not only because people are anti-gay or homophobic, but for many, simply because it's Kirk and Spock, who have such solid identities in the cultural consciousness.

7/1/2009 #100

Re: The Uhura Conversation (or @Docling, whatever):

While it's true that conversations like this can turn nasty, as long as everyone respects that we each have different viewpoints and different interpretations and that those interpretations will not always match--and in fact, may often be entirely opposed--there's no harm in discussing it. The important thing is to attack the argument, not the arguer, and not to get carried away.

For my part, I had a number of problems with the Spock/Uhura relationship. To be blunt, the teacher/student thing struck me very negatively, simply because the way I see Spock, it's difficult for me to accept that he would be open to that. I very much liked Uhura's characterization in the new film; my critique of the PTB on this one is that they set her up as a wicked awesome character and then didn't do much with her in the later portions of the movie other than positioning her as Spock's love interest (which is where the "arm candy" label gets applied). I would have felt better about the whole relationship if it had been portrayed differently, I think. If we had been able to see something other than (what I mentally refer to as) the mauling of Spock in the turbolift and the makeout/"I'll be monitoring your frequency" in the transporter room. The moment in the beginning when she demands to be put on the Enterprise (which I quite liked for a number of reasons that I'm not going to tl;dr you all with) is about the only indication we have that they have any sort of relationship at all--as teacher and student, colleagues, friends, love interests, whatever. The comes-out-of-nowhere feeling of the turbolift scene bothered me more than the introduction of the Spock/Uhura romance in itself. Obviously, your mileage may vary. Everyone will have a different interpretation of the film and the characters and events in it. The important thing with any critical conversation is to remember that, and not to start flaming and bashing one another left and right. ^_^

7/1/2009 #101
Me Or The Wallpaper

In a way, it's what we're working at. Allowing characters to be gay or lesbian without it being The Issue Of The Plot is certainly a big goal, especially in mainstream media franchises and so on. But my point about Kirk and Spock's status in the cultural consciousness runs a little deeper than the amount to which public opinion on homosexuality has shifted since the 60s. Much like Superman and other high-status cultural objects, people have an emotional connection to these characters, whether they know it or not. If the next Star Trek positioned Kirk and Spock as homosexual lovers? You would be surprised at the number of people who would suddenly care, and not like it. It's not, no joke intended here, logical. When Superman "died" it made national newspaper headlines. That's a comic book character. But an iconic one, and one that has a lot of collective memory and symbolism built up around him. Kirk and Spock occupy a similar place in American popular culture and our cultural consciousness (as well as a place of near-if-not-outright reverencein the history of SF/F). There are already sections of Trek fandom and of the mainstream culture who are upset at the degree to which J.J. took liberties with Trek canon and changed backstories and so on. The outcry against an explicitly homosexual relationship between the two would be tremendous, not only because people are anti-gay or homophobic, but for many, simply because it's Kirkand Spock, who have such solid identities in the cultural consciousness.I know. I'm saying 'all the more reason,' almost. Perhaps I myself have an idealistic view of the world from watching too much Star Trek in my life and all that, but I'm saying that theyshould care more about a good cause than the fact that some people- and definitely not all the people- are going to be upset. They WILL loose fans if they do this, I know, they know. What everyone should understand is that they will also GAIN them. And you can go into statistics about how they'd definitely loose more than gain them, but what I'm saying right here is that this is seriously, HONESTLY, this era's version of the interacial kiss. People all went through thinking the same things, believe me, and everyone probably thought it was just as crazy. But they did it anyway.

Again. Perhaps I'm only being idealistic by giving the creators a little more credit.

7/1/2009 #102

Hey guys, I'm not going to be adding to the debate quite yet, carry on though.

But I wanted to let you all know that seetreklove.com is now online, with a small little under construction page to boot! =D

There is a link there to this forum, as well as the website with the essays on K/S. Also, there is a contact link, which is the e-mail account I just set up for the site.

Anytime you want to shoot me an e-mail at webmaster at seetreklove.com feel free. I will be using this e-mail for trafficing of ideas, and also as a means of contact. I might diverge this into separate e-mail accounts for different purposes, but that's down the line. I suppose I could set up some additional e-mail accounts on the website if anyone really wanted one. XD

Anywho, yay! We have a step done. Now, to start on that writing. Help, anyone? Haha.

Twitter/Facebook/Myspace will follow shortly... as soon as I figure out what to say on them.

7/1/2009 . Edited 7/1/2009 #103

ETA: @Wallpaper:

It may be idealistic, but that's not a bad thing. I'd say it's an excellent reflection of your character, actually. I like idealists. They give me hope.

But we're talking about petitioning a major studio to take a big risk. The unfortunate truth is that it's not really up to the creators as much as I'm sure we all wish it was. J.J., for instance, will be given a certain amount of leeway with what the studios and financiers of the film will let him do, because he's got a reputation for successful work that makes good money. But those same studios and financiers aren't concerned about making a social statement. They're concerned with getting a return on their multi-million dollar investment. It's cold and it's unfeeling, but the money rules Hollywood. If Star Trek were being privately financed (like, to use a rather distasteful *to me* example, Mel Gibson's Passion of the Christ)? Then the creators would have all the freedom they could want to make everyone gay if they felt like it. I would absolutely die of joy if a major studio said, Screw the profit, we're going to do this because it SHOULD be like this, it's RIGHT to include this, it is MORALLY PRAISEWORTHY that this appear. But I won't hold my breath. There are too many people waiting to be paid for them to make that leap without solid financial numbers to back it up.

7/1/2009 . Edited 7/1/2009 #104

Wow, that was really quick on the website. Just one small problem, I can't actually access the essay's (which I presume are through the 'love' link) it mayb just be an issue with the school pc's, but you may want to check it just in case. And yeah to whoever said it, i know Sulu/Chekov isn't canon, but they're still semi important characters who aren't Kirk or Spock, possibly helping with the whole national icon thing. Anyway, they were more or less the first pairi9ng I thought of and i had to hurry to get this done before school.

oops, really have to go now.

7/1/2009 #105
Catri Howlman-Carthaki spy

I understand that there are people who wouldn't like K/S (*points to family*) which is why I suggested...having something in there. Some recognizable character who isn't going to randomly die for no good reason, maybe? That's also the reason I worded my list the way I did. I was trying to seem less like a geeky fourteen-year-old and more like a young woman who knows how to be mature. If we can get maturity across (as a collective), and manage to have a (collective) backbone without being mulish, it works in our favor.

If they can find actors to agree and ways to work it in without becoming overbearing about it, that's fine with me, so long as it isn't "Red-shirt-Ricky" as was stated before.

We have to watch our words, yes, and be careful not to push too hard, yes, but we also need to be clear about what we're asking for. It's not a good idea to be vague when you want something, or else you end up getting something you don't want. I know the difference between saying "I want a book for my birthday" and "I want Elkhound by Tamora Pierce for my birthday". If I were to say "book", I run the risk of getting "Puff the Magic Dragon" or "Chicken Soup for the Teenage Soul" - neither of which I want. In the same way, we need to be specific. Maybe not as specific as that, but give a list saying "These are some things we'd like to see in the next movie, and these are the things we would like to see done a bit differently and will you please take these into account as you're working" or something along those lines. In my experience, even if you're completely out of line, you get off easy when you're respectful.

Am I rambling again?

As for the Vulcan kiss thing: I only brought it up because it would be a lot easier to get across than a full-blown tongue-in-mouth wandering-hands make-out session. Something small enough to keep from scaring people away, but present enough to get the pint across. Finger contact in general for Vulcans is a very serious thing (from my understanding; I might be wrong), so...Spock could watch Uhura lick her fingers after eating for all I care! Well, maybe not Uhura, but...there's a lot of information they can slip under the radar, or maybe even not-so-subtle flirting.

Again, it doesn't have to be K/S, although it would be a nice example of a relationship we'd like to see on screen or see emulatedon screen. If they had character who weren't cannon fodder possessing a relationship with the same love undertones (and overtones) of K/S, then hey! I think we've accomplished something. We just have to present it in a way that doesn't make us sound like...well...fourteen-year-olds.

Just a thought.


p.s.: Is there and age restriction on the proofreading, or can I volunteer? I may not be perfect, but I'm pretty good at picking up blatant and easily missed errors. (So long as I'm not immediately reading after I type.)

p.p.s.: Forgive the rambling. As I stated before, I'm practically a hermit, so I tend to go one and on. I also jump around a lot because my brain will start going off in different directions based on random words and phrases. I apologize.

p.p.p.s.: Please forgive any spelling/grammar errors. In things like this it's easy for me to miss things the first three look-overs. I also blame a recent lack of sleep.

7/1/2009 #106
Me Or The Wallpaper

Meh, well, let's hope it's a reflection on my character, because then it could also be phrased stubborn believer, which is possibly one of the most adored insults ever directed at me. :-D Might as well expect good if I'm trying either way.

To cut idealism a bit and go into the Vulcan way of thinking, they probably wouldn't loose all that much profit. And yes. I know this also sounds idealistic, but I think they know that Star Trek will make a huge amount of money no matter what's in it. It's kind of like how JK Rowling could writing a short picture book about Sirius Black meeting a constipated rabbit trying to find it's way to The Wiz and there would still be midnight parties for getting it, and anyone who had anything to do with putting it out there in the world would end up rich. And part of this whole 'movement' thing then is to convince the studios and financiers as well as JJ why this would be a good thing.

And you're right, don't hold your breath. As Jimmy says, you can't have sex and hold your breath, so any Jimmy approved activities would be put on hold, if you're even participating in them, but let's not get into that. Also, I don't think we're going to be putting our best effort forth if we're all just standing around holding our breath like a bunch of careful Vulcans.

7/1/2009 #107

I was going to read all the posts I had missed before I said something in response, but I need to say this now before I forget...

Pirate College Graduate (awesome name, btw!) mentioned wanting to see K/S flirting addressed rather than it just being moments coming out of nowhere, and suddently it hit me - Bones would be a great way to do this! He's Jim's best friend, who doesn't let him get away with any crap, so he could definitely be the one to call Jim on his flirting with Spock. It could be just a line or two that the writers insert, and it would just be soo Bones - "Dammit, Jim! Stop making eyes at Spock and get your ass down to Sickbay!" ...Or whatever. Even if we never get any K/S kissing, just the fact that one of the main characters would outright call it flirting would be great, right? It was always there but unstated, before.

7/1/2009 #108


Back again. Blame evil college timetables for the lack of substance to my last post. Like Catty-the-spy, I would love to help out with proofreading, or anything that needs doing really.

Just a thought, I actually have a captive audience readily available. My school has weekly assemblies, on the way in, there is a powerpoint, I could probably even ask to mention it during the assembly itself, other people have for various clubs and stuff, we could even put up a powerpoint presentation. Dunno if it's something you want to think about, but there would be over a thousand people there, including a lesbian teacher so even if only a few people are interested its an easy way to get the word out.

And, since I was utterly bored after my science test, I spent my time productively and came up with 13 potential banners/badges, a logo and 2 icons, uh... slightly...suggestive... is a little mild I suppose, but, how do you feel about having the words 'Help Kitty (picture of a cat) Get the Cream' go around a few times and then replace Kitty with Kirk? or 'the Cat(picture of cat)/Kirk that got the cream'? if someone could make those I would love them forever, cause I'm really bad at that sort of thing.

And, yeah, love the idea of Bones telling Jim to stop psychically molesting Spock or whatever, that could be funny.

7/1/2009 #109
Me Or The Wallpaper

Lol, I'd pay to see the initial responses of the people in that assembly. But yeah, you should definitely try in my opinion. Just make sure your power point is... good. And remember that this is about civil rights style stuff as apposed to making a popular pairing hook up. ^_^

I feel... like such an innocent person... which hasn't... HAPPENED in a while... since I started spending... more time... one the internet...(andnowIfeellikeShatner)

What did that joke mean?

7/1/2009 #110

Am guessing its about the cat that got the cream thing, well to start with Kitty and Kirk have the same first 2 letters which got me a few odd looks when I started giggling, and then its because Kirk+Spock+Slash=slightly different cream. If you read enough bad sex scenes you start to notice things like that popping up kinda often.

7/1/2009 #111
Me Or The Wallpaper

Literal Response: What does tha- GAH!!! *head to desk*

7/1/2009 #112

Okay, I've finally read everything and caught up (and am definitely agreeing with the folks used to lj that ff's forum is awkward...). I don't think I have anything new to add, except for this:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to be debated here as to whether or not this group can advocate for a strong(er) Uhura character, right? Given that I think we've pretty much settled on SEE Trek (Social-Equality Effort Trek), I would say that this does indeed fall under our purview. So perhaps we should ask for a show of hands of who is in favor of adding to our to-do list?

7/1/2009 #113

Hey everyone! I'm glad people are liking the idea of an LGBT SF/F group umbrella-ing what would be our first main project, which would be K/S in nuTrek2. Keep the thoughts coming on this idea, and if your for it, just go ahead and say "Yay!" :)

We could also come up with other projects, but for the time being, I think it would be good just to start by focusing on Trek. Also, someone mentioned contacting LGBT agencies; I think this would be very beneficial to our cause, and it really actually is something that the general gay community and the general nerd community can get behind.

@Lindsay, I imagine they discussed where they are potentially going in future arcs, but that may or may not be set in stone. We're just going to have to do a little convincing. ^_^

@Docling, Welcome! I think if we talk about a Uhura, it will have to be talking about her in a positive light, because she really is an awesome character, and I think if we show that we wants best for her, as well as the awesome lovers Kirk and Spock, then no one will have a complaint. Everyone's happy. :)

@mikkiness, The essays probably have to do with the school computers. They work fine on my computer. Also, about your school: go for it! But I want to wait for the heavy advertising until we have an impressive website up and everything else. I want this to look good. So once we have everything, I'm not going to stop anybody from making any presentations, and the more exposure we can get, the better!

Okay. So I know we're still in baby stages, but it's time to get cracking. I know there have been several offering their artistic, marketing/promotional and writing talents, so, if you're serious about this, please PM me, so we can start talking logistics.

Thank you guys all so much! I'm glad we're kind of coming to agreements on some level!

SEE Trek has kind of become the name of this project, but I am still open to slogans, banner ideas, et cetera.

@Catri Howlman-Carthaki spy, I'd say, sure. I'll let you do some proofreading, but since you're slightly younger (I'm guessing that's what your insinuating) I'll probably have someone with more experience do the heavier editing.

7/1/2009 #114

*Makes sure there aren't any perverted Vulcans around, then shows hand*

7/1/2009 #115
Catri Howlman-Carthaki spy

I was just curious. I wanted to know if you had to be legal or something, cause I'm legal to get a driver's permit and...not much else, I think. Not that I know of anyway.

I certainly can't vote (which sucks).

Anyway...yay, I get to help! I can use my very small skill-set!!

7/1/2009 #116
Dreamera Tear

*blinks* EMAIL FLOODING... I'm sooooooo glad I use Gmail so that my email from FFN is usually all packaged into a digest like thingy...

Right, there are seriously too many things to address here. So first and foremost, thank you SolarCat for addressing my questions and playing Devil's Advocate for us. We're a bunch of idealistic people here immensely inspired to change the world here in whatever way we can, and personally, I would feel that even if we aren't successful, just getting the publicity on this issue might get people to start thinking about the issue, and how acting on these ideals and trying to make them happen is better than just sitting around and doing nothing. We can talk about how we want more social equality for all and stuff, but that's all crap if you don't do anything about it. Hell knows you can't depend on politicians and stuff; they're all just a bunch of sad people who hide behind their power and make half-arsed promises.

So although you have brought up lots of points and stuff that definitely means we could be doing all this and end up having no results to show for all our effort, or a bad result, I still think merely having the movement makes a big difference. Hence my support for this, even though IRL I really am a rather realistic bastard amongst my friends who plays Devil's Advocate to their crazy ideas and stuff. I think we need this. We can just start small first, but then we can also branch out larger into other TV serials and movies to ask for the same thing - A much more casual representation of homosexualtiy and stuff. It probably means I will be seeing lots of censoring in Singapore and lots of TV shows may not be screened in Singapore anymore (homophobia is WAAAAY high here), but I think it's worth it. I liked the idea someone had above, it could be like the first level of the casual bromance/romance between Spock and Kirk, about Bones commenting on Kirk's continuous flirting with Spock. I mean, it doesn't highlight it in bold letters, but that would be enough for starters. Then we can start talking about the second level of the relationship and stuff, slowly but surely making it one of the best movies ever. I mean, I think movies with homosexuality in it really do have the potential to make money - I remember once when I was younger and went on this school trip to UK, and like, the message was being spread around to everyone involved in the trip that Brokeback Mountain would be showing on our flight. I think more than 60% of the students involved were watching that particular screening, even if most of us were probably underaged for it. *oops, lol*

@Lance: Are you gonna be looking for mods and stuff for different parts of the world and stuff? Coordinating stuff in different time zones; to give it a little more organization so that it can get bigger without getting messy. Coz I'm kinda wondering if I'm the only Singaporean here, and the only Asian here (considering the time zone that I usually see people here). Asians make up quite a large proportion of the population, and I'm sure if we can coordinate the Asian community, we'd have a substantially larger voice. Let's try to infect more people around the world with this yeah! (omg i make us sound like a disease! but a nice one, really. nicer than the swine flu. i just watched the recording of the mtv movie awards last night and watched jim carey get his award - it was hilarious lol)

7/1/2009 #117

@terriestral-angell, I will be needing a couple of moderators, although initially I doubt we'll need that many. If for some reason it becomes a bigger thing, then I will have to have a larger amount of them, but for now probably just a couple will do. If you're willing, then it would be totally beneficial to have you on the team! Just drop me a PM so I know you're serious. Thank you!

7/1/2009 #118
Pirate College Graduate

@cestmoi01: Thank you! And I agree as well. If Bones sees something out of the norm, or just downright whack, he's definitely not quiet about it. What a great idea!

And here's a link to a video I found, completely unrelated to this. It's just the video that I got my username from:


7/1/2009 #119

-waves- I saw this, and just had to create a FF account and wait my 24 hours and everything to say that I'm in love with this idea. I'm totally on board. I have...a lot... of friends and accounts on the various networking sites, so I'd love to be a secret-ninja-spreader of the slashy and equality goodness. I'm also willing to make a few videos and such to share, if you'd like. Still learning editing, so it'd be good practice for a good cause.

On a brief offtopic note (SO sorry)- I'm amazed at how nice you all are...I rarely find anyone but trolls and RAGE on the internet, so finding some friendly, open-minded people to talk to made me all the more willing. 3

7/1/2009 #120
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