The Mechanics of In Flight
One of my reviewers mentioned the idea of starting a forum for those who want to debate various points of my story without clogging up the review section too much. I decided to go ahead and give it a try.
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Maimakterion

Here we go.

Just to save the crossover ideas thread from a 15 page derail.

starting with 'can rho aias block the killing curse?'

go!

5/26/2011 #1
whodidthewhatnow

Rho Aias can change destiny, making a spear that pierced the heart of the opponent before is throw don't actually pierces the heart.

I'm sure that qualifies as an Yes. The only problem is to determine how many petals it would burst. My take would be between three to four.

5/26/2011 #2
Shioran Toushin

nice, if the shield considers AK as a projectile then yes it can block it, if not then it still is a physical shield and will block the AK.

Next question AK can one shot Shiro? IIRC it forcefully expels the soul from the body, so for me it would be situational, because in Nasu there are may talismans and Magic resistance, so the aspect would be diminished, also Shiro has Avalon wich protects him against AM wich is the ultimate curse, so IMOH somtimes kills him sometimes not.

5/26/2011 #3
Shioran Toushin

wow wow wow when did Rho cnage destiny? because IIRC the only things it blocked were Gae Bolg in it's not so hax homing missile of doom mode, a barrage from GoB, Ea and in H/A Hurunting.

5/26/2011 #4
Maimakterion

In Nasu there is also passive magic resistance, in HP magic resistance is ALL active. That should make a pretty big diference to all the unforgivables shouldnt it? And indeed all spells.

Oh, and while i am firmly on the Rho Aias could block avada kedavra side here i do have to point out to whodidthewhatnow that Aias didnt reverse causality to block lancer when he fought archer, Lancer simply used spear of striking death flight, not spear of impaling barbed death.

5/26/2011 #5
whodidthewhatnow

Don't both have the never miss issue on them? I remember a discussion where everyone keep saying both had that ability.

5/26/2011 #6
Amoral Philosopher

I like to think that Rho Aias could block the AK not because of any special ability Rho Aias has, but simply because it is a physical object. It would actually be pretty overkill to use Rho Aias to block an AK when a simple normal shield, a wall, or even a piece of paper would do just as well. The AK is considered unblockable only to spell shields and is instakill if hit. Harry survived when he was a baby because of some ridiculously corny reasoning JK Rowling called the power of love when Harry's mother sacrificed her life for him. There is no reason to make Shirou impervious to the AK or even weaken its effects on him when the AK isn't that amazing anyway. It is easily blockable as long as you are smart enough to throw a physical object in its way.

5/26/2011 #7
Maimakterion

Striking death flight guarantees the maximum number of enemies within its blast radius, not actually striking an individual target

5/26/2011 #8
Maimakterion

I recall dumbledore transfiguring something in front of him to block it in the loby scene in book ... whatever. the one where sirius dies i tihnk. order of the phoenix, thats it.

that makes it cannon right?

5/26/2011 #9
hanashinobi

Do you think no one would think to summon up a physical wall to block it? If you want the admittedly loose logic of HP magic to work then ALL but the most powerful of magic defenses must not be able to stop it, including transfiguration. That being said HP is a childrens series and its rule system is ment to be taken lightly.

Edit: I type slowly.

5/26/2011 . Edited 5/26/2011 #10
Maimakterion

I figure that, as with radiation, a physical barrier must place a certain amount of mass between you and the spell in order to stop it, so it is likely that the average mage simply cannot transfigure enough matter that quickly to block AK reliably in combat, which is why it is so much better for most to dodge.

Dumbledore, being a skilled combattant, with an excellent combat focus (elder wand = mystic code for duelling baby!) AND a stated preference for transfiguration, is probably the only one that can pull up that much matter more easily than diving to one side.

On a related note - could conjured matter block it do you think or would it react as a magical impediment and do sod all? I'm just asking because tracing ... yeah.

5/26/2011 #11
Shioran Toushin

the death flight has a homing aplication, just instead of reversing causality or being redirected it just follows you until you are in the explotion raduis

NVM found this http://img845.imageshack.us/g/lancer.jpg/

and dumbles transfigures and animates things regularily to block AK spam, and it has to be a solid object IIRC because if it's not then the AK just burn past them.

5/26/2011 #12
Amoral Philosopher

Yes, it is cannon that any physical object can block the AK, wheather it be conjured, transfigured, or whatever. As long as you are not using a shield made of magic such as "protego" you are in the clear. With that being the case, it makes no sense to make Shirou in any way resistant to the AK when there is no reason to power down the curse's ability. The only thing that makes the AK so great is that it could nick you on your big toe and you would still die. Shirou is easily agile and smart enough to avoid being hit.

Edit: The reason the AK is so forbidden is that its only purpose is to kill. It has no other uses.

5/26/2011 . Edited 5/26/2011 #13
Shioran Toushin

its not nerfing it, but really Mages have MR and wizards do not, unless that's Imperious and that resistancce is will based.

and forcefully ripping your soul from your body even if its not permanent or lasts a few microseconds it would left you incapacited for a while (from mins to hours if not monts/years) so MR reduces or diminishes that effect, but doesnt make you inmune to it, unless you have servant level MR

5/26/2011 #14
Amoral Philosopher

Eh, I guess I just don't agree. I see the AK as capable of ripping through any MR. I say this because that is essentially what a magic shield such as "protego" is. Protego shields the user through magic and if the opposing spell is more powerful, it reduces the opposing spells effect. The AK bypasses all that.

Edit: I have to admit though, none of this really matters. This is more of an issue of such a grey area that it would be the author's prerogative to go about it as they see fit. It could go either way with reasoning on both sides.

5/26/2011 . Edited 5/26/2011 #15
Shioran Toushin

Protection against magical effects. Differently from the Resistance effect that merely rejects prana, this ability cancels the spells altogether. Important to note that the term "verse" seen below refers to a set of three lines. Thus, a chant of two verses is equivalent to a Six-Line incantation.

A: Cancel spells of A-Rank or below. In practice, the Servant is untouchable to modern magi.

B: Cancel spells with a chant below three verses. Even if targeted by High-Thaumaturgy and Greater Rituals, it is difficult for him to be affected. (As Saber Alter, Arturia suffered a rank-down in this skill due her corruption)

C: Cancel spells with a chant below two verses. Cannot defend against Magecraft on the level of High-Thaumaturgy and Greater Rituals. (Because she herself does not have any Magic Resistance, Nero boasts a low level that is unbecoming of the Saber Class)

D: Cancel Single-Action spells. Magic Resistance of the same degree of an amulet that rejects magical energy.

E: Cannot cancel spells, but magic damage is reduced somewhat. (Lancelot'soriginates from a magical ring, however its powers received a rank-down due to Mad Enhancement)

that is MR the innate or artificial ways to cancell a spell, they are not Shields, but a form of damage reduction liek harder skin or denser bones. but most of the mortal magi and humans have a much lower MR so it is a grey area.

and:

Resistance

抗魔力 - Koumaryoku

A power inherent of anyone with Magic Circuits, the capacity to resist spells which aim to control the target by the spiritual medium (those among the lines of sleep, paralysis and coercion). By circulating prana inside his Circuits, one can reject outside prana that tries to invade his self. Therefore, it is possible to disrupt a spell before it can complete itself. A very efficient form of defense, it makes difficult to affect even lesser magi. Also, those who are not magi but still possess Magic Circuits may unconsciously protect themselves like this. Because of it, most magi use spells capable of physical interference rather than just spiritual ones.

However, what is being rejected is the prana, not the spell itself. A spell that has already been completed and is manifesting its effects cannot be cancelled like this. Caster, however, is an exception. She can disrupt even completed spells due to her absurd amount of prana and because the structure of modern Magecraft's spells are far inferior to those of her time.

5/26/2011 . Edited 5/26/2011 #16
Amoral Philosopher

Ya, I was never suggesting that a simple AK could kill something like a servant. I was only referring to its capability of killing mortal beings such as humans and other magi. I wouldn't think it would be capable of killing something like a dragon in the HP universe either.

5/26/2011 #17
Shioran Toushin

that's what i said MR for magi goes varies from no rank to E-D normally, and there are always exceptions, plus most of the magi carry amulets, but as i said in my previous posts even if the mages have an e-d rank the AK still rip their souls even if for a moment(on exeptional cases)

its not nerfing it, but really Mages have MR and wizards do not, unless that's Imperious and that resistancce is will based.

and forcefully ripping your soul from your body even if its not permanent or lasts a few microseconds it would left you incapacited for a while (from mins to hours if not monts/years) so MR reduces or diminishes that effect, but doesnt make you inmune to it, unless you have servant level MR

that is MR the innate or artificial ways to cancell a spell, they are not Shields, but a form of damage reduction liek harder skin or denser bones. but most of the mortal magi and humans have a much lower MR so it is a grey area.

5/26/2011 . Edited 5/26/2011 #18
Maimakterion

I dont really think the magic resistance of a mortal mage will do it. Someone like Zelretch or Bersercules may be able to tank an AK and laugh but not a mortal mage.

Magic resistance might come into play for the other unforgivables though, which was where (i at least) was pointing this

5/26/2011 #19
Fallen Otaku

It may be possible for people who aren't Zelretch or Berserkales to take AK to the face and survive. At the end of book 7, didn't Harry survive anouther AK by not being afraid to die? As long as you do not fear death, or are aware that for the curse to work you must at least feel fear, then anyone could survive it. Or was Harry surviving AK a result of him actually being the owner of the wand?

5/26/2011 . Edited 5/26/2011 #20
Calpeto9

The HPverse had so many flaws that I don't even know where to begin. Kieran made a Type-Moon/Harry Potter crossover with Shirou, Takara who is the daughter of Shiki and Ciel, Ilya, and Galen "rebirthing" into the setting. He points out TONNES of plotholes and fixes it. The first few paragraphs might be a little daunting if you haven't read any of the prequels, but it gets really really good further in. Here:

http://nrvnqsr.us.to/showthread.php/209-FF-Trinity-I-The-Stone-(Type-Moon-Harry-Potter-X-over)

http://nrvnqsr.us.to/showthread.php/238-Trinity-II-The-Chamber-(Type-Moon-Harry-Potter-X-over)

http://nrvnqsr.us.to/showthread.php/273-FF-Trinity-III-The-Prisoner-(Type-Moon-Harry-Potter-X-over)

http://nrvnqsr.us.to/showthread.php/292-FF-Trinity-IV-The-Tournament-(Type-Moon-Harry-Potter-X-over)

A lot of things in HPverse doesn't make sense the way people are arguing about it:

1. Transfiguration is permanent: Why would HPverse need jobs if they can transform sh*t into food or clothes.

A. I think transfiguration is basically like a more versatile version of Projection. Not Shirou level Projection, but other magi projection.

2. HPverse is more powerful than Nasuverse: HPverse needs the added power of magical beasts, in wands, to even get to the level of being a minor irritant to a dragon. Keep in mind that HPverse dragons are definately AT THE VERY LEAST 5 TIMES WEAKER than Nasuverse dragons. They also consider a fully grown Troll to be deadly when RON IN FIRST YEAR could knock it out with a first year charm when he is below average in terms of skills.

3. Teleportation: HPverse style is basically you remembering a place and use a bit of magic and then just really really wanting to go there. How would that even work without setting up an Artifact for it? Rowling doesn't even give the excuse that a particular area's magic is remembered and therefore if you synchronize the frequency....or something.

4. Time turner: Why do they give a time-turner to a little girl who isn't even a pureblood nor is she influential; a better question is why would Dumbledore give such a powerful artifact to a 13 year old girl? It is also basically ignored until Harry destroys all of it in the Fifth book.

5. And This Contributes to my most WTF moment Spell: In book 7 Harry Potter defeated Voldemort with A DISARMING SPELL WHEN VOLDEMORET FREAKING THREW AK AND VOLDEMORT LOST?!!! That's like saying a regular normal joe THREW A ROCK at someone who is holding a handgun and the rock KNOCKS THE BULLET BACK TOWARDS THE SHOOTER. WTF???!!!

5/26/2011 . Edited 5/26/2011 #21
Maimakterion

It was due to Harry being the legitimite owner of all three deathly hallows and having the appropriate mindset for each.

Not fearing death allowed him to make full use of the cloak's ability to hide from death.

Not wanting to force the dead to live again allowed him to use the stone to speak to the dead truly.

And of course he was the master of the wand voldemort cast the killing curse with.

5/26/2011 #22
Calpeto9

I get that Harry was the master of the three hallows, but A DISARMING SPELL when it is a second year charm? WTF did he learn at Hogwarts.

5/26/2011 #23
Maimakterion

Oh no, that was answering fallen Otaku's question as to why he didnt die out in the snow when he confronted voldemort before the final duel.

the fatal disarm doesnt make sense.

Maybe if it was a disarm in the Negima sense (where it actually destroys the weapons. Wind turns them into petals and blows them away, ice freezes them and shatters them to pieces etc) and he simply overpowered it until it affected the weilder and not the weapon. But this is just a knock it out of their grip spell. So yeah i totally get the rage at that one.

5/26/2011 #24
Fallen Otaku

I don't understand how dissarming caused the spell to go after Voldy either. Hell, one time I explained to someone, whom would never read the books but wanted to be in the know, about that 'fight'. He thought it was the Hary Potter version of Dirty Harry.

5/26/2011 #25
Calpeto9

I thought Harry Potter 1-4 was good, and 5 & 6 was O.K, but with Book 7 I basically forgot about most of it after a month. That was how bad Book 7 was. Considering I remember books 1-4 plotpoints when I haven't read it in 9 years....sooo...yeeaaahhh.

5/26/2011 . Edited 5/26/2011 #26
Amoral Philosopher

Ya...Rowling kinda dropped the ball after book 5 in my opinion. She had a fairly decent setup going before that, but she pretty much drove the story into the ground after, each book getting progressively worse. I am not even going to touch the Harry/Ginny pairing that she pulled out of her as*.

5/26/2011 #27
whodidthewhatnow

@Shinkir0 Is that Galen and Takara from another fic of his? It's quite complicated for a backstory for a crossover.

5/26/2011 #28
Calpeto9

Yes it is. But don't worry about it. After reading partway into the first page it focuses more on how they interact at Hogwarts. Don't let the first few paragraphs prevent you from reading further. It's really really really good.

5/26/2011 #29
hanashinobi

Rolling did not drop the ball, we just got more mature. This is a KIDS book, I love most of the books and grew up with them but we have to understand is that the rules were purposely loose so we could better understand them and not to ruin the wonder of magic in kids eyes that comes from the unpredictable. this happens with a lot of the goods series for kids because we can no longer see them as kids but as adults who have a firmer grip on logic. What Rolling tried to do for book five and on was mature the series by bringing laws to it but she is a childrens writer, not an adult fantasy writer and she did not do the best job bridging the two.

5/27/2011 #30
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