The Mechanics of In Flight
One of my reviewers mentioned the idea of starting a forum for those who want to debate various points of my story without clogging up the review section too much. I decided to go ahead and give it a try.
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Master Basher

Since Kittybear started Emiya Clan 3 in advance, why not?

Also, a simple throwback to the last threads lack of 2/II's :(

12/25/2011 . Edited by Mu-Sensei, 1/11 #1
Valerian18

Um, this is just a random thought I came with today, but what would Shiro think of the world of Simoun as a magi given that these pilots essentially trace gigantic runes/glyphs in the sky for attacks.

And on entirely comedic aside, Shiro in a world filed with only women and "men" who were sex-changed to be so, would be hilarious. The BAR would not even be fair since no one else in that world would think to jump it in the first place.

Just a thought.

12/27/2011 #2
watcherinthevoid

@Valerian18

Disclaimer: i have only read a summery of it so their will be holes the size of the death star in my understanding of it.

That would seem to be very cruel after all since they're all born female would that mean that the bar would affect the males as well since they were 100% female before.

Not to mention they will be very confused that someone could be born male since that kind of thought would be deemed imposable since everyone has been born female since forever or whenever it started so that fact is a blind spot in their society but if you really wanted to mess with that world you would have to drop him in before the HGW since he would too old ( i really need to finish/start up playing the VN to get a better grasp on the world. But they did mention his grade level but again i don't know what the age for that would be in japan since they do their grade age different then the USA) , why because of that they would think that he had chosen his gender and be very if not completely resistant to letting him into one of those machines.

BUT since he never had to chose his gender or the fact he was born male could active a glitch in the machines since they wouldn't be able to tell whether or not he's too old or has chosen a gender so it would mess with them even harder and allow you to drop him in after the HGW right into one of the machines.

Then all that's left cover the how did he get there in the first place since you would need some real world building to have him born there ( since everyone is meant to be born female) to get close to a good story without coming off heavy handed. So it would fall to the good old second magic to drop cosmic plaything #1 into that universe so in the end it would have to be Rin or Zel's job to get him there be it by one of Rin's mistakes, Zel trolling as he always does or some other way that you can think of to drop him there.

12/27/2011 #3
Valerian18

That was a very well-thought out response. I appreciate the attention you gave to that idea. And yes, the point was to be cruel and screw with the heads of everyone in the setting.

I hadn't thought age would be an issue for shiro, because I did not consider him piloting in the first place.

My idea was that he was dropped in the world earlier and managed to wind up as a mechanic on the ship/carrier. The other option was to have him fall from the sky in the middle of their "combat" training.

Both options have their good points: In the first one he can observe society relatively inconspicuously, since (post HGW) version would be considered old enough to be past his choosing stage. I can see him choosing to work on the ship as a way to be closer to the action (saving people) without having to reveal his abilities or place himself under direct military command (He would still be in the military by being maintenance though, I guess). The second option would have the pilots/priestesses thinking he was a divine sign/answer to some prayer and shiro's bumbling nature would confuse everyone massively. In this version, he would probably be watched like a hawk, so he wouldn't be able to do any tricks on side during combat without being seen unless he was very lucky.....and we all know that shiro isn't.

Either way it would be fun.

12/28/2011 #4
Lycodrake

@watcherinthevoid and Valerian18: First off, the other thread is still going. Second, what you're proposing just sounds like an overdose of Vandread, possibly minus the mecha. I have a few other comments on the idea, but I'll hold back. ^^;

12/28/2011 #5
Master Basher

Other than that, I'd post a link back here when it's juuuust about to hit another 5000 mark. :{P

EDIT: Now it's officially the thread, since I'm lucky enough to get the last post. :P

Anyhoo...

@Ghoohg,

It'd as easy as swapping a few characters. For instance, imagine a loop that has Emiya Shiki, and Nanaya Shirou.

12/28/2011 . Edited 12/29/2011 #6
Lycodrake

@Master Basher: ...Tsundere wouldn't cover it. It's Shitsurakuen. The main character's hero complex doesn't make room for another "hero", especially the way things are there...i.e. FUBAR sexism everywhere.

12/29/2011 #7
Master Basher

@Lyco,

... whoa, waitaminute! Is Shitsurakuen that manga in which the system itself is Evil towards both genders?

If that's the case, then I'd guess Shirou would try to break the game, permamently, consequence be damned. Still, the fact that it works similer to the HGW in some ways might give Shirou a bit of an edge.

12/29/2011 #8
Lycodrake

@Master Basher: Yeah, it's that one. T_T;

I would just want Shirou to prove them wrong entirely. Especially if it were, say...Shirou and Saber Alter together.

...I ship Shirou/Alter. X3

12/29/2011 . Edited 12/29/2011 #9
Master Basher

Heck, I'd be overkill if Shirou had an army of Sabers. :P

On a more serious note, UBW's Shirou is pretty broken. Especially if he can pull in enough prana/mana *VR* to unleash a few Broken Phantasms. Any attempts to force him into complying with the system or face a 'fate worse than death' would just result in Shirou going Dark Messiah by a potencial Fake Excaliblast if it gets that bad.

Afterwards, it'd be School Holidays. Assuming any females are able to even get that privilage in such a setting.

12/29/2011 #10
Lycodrake

@Master Basher: I had in mind HF route Shirou, or at least a version of him...which I don't think would be too OP. Plus Saber Alter, who may or may not be OP in the setting. XP

I can't stop RAGING about the story to even look into holidays for it all...considering that parents send their children there, I doubt it. T_T;

12/29/2011 #11
ghoohg

Moving my last post over here cause the other thread is full.

Heh, so many good stories (especially time loops) have gotten left off. (seriously, anyone know what happened to Innortal?)

Was thinking, and had an "Oh, CRAP!" moment. Rin with Sakura Syndrome.

OH, and just THINK of all the goodies Shirou could pick up from the loops. How long would a Dead Apostle last against Voltron?

12/29/2011 #12
watcherinthevoid

@Valerian18

if your wondering where the talk of Simoun check the last page of the last thread.

@Lycodrake

Personally i wouldn't care if Shirou was op since the world of Shitsurakuen need a good hard smack in the face since it's just so black and white aka male=evil sob while being female=slave until the hero of the story shows up. Also i don't think Shirou would care what the "heroine" has to say about what he does unless she says he's the same as all the other men where upon he would call out her ideals and her narrow minded view of the world and if she attacked him after he finished talk the shear different in skill he would win. Which could lead to a scene where all the males around at the time would go say how he put her in her place where he would then lay a beat down on all of them.

Then there's also the fact that Shirou is perfectly fine with killing if it's needed to be done to save someone no i am not talking about MOS runs on statistical value on to kill the lest to save the most. but i sure as hell wouldn't advise to ship them together sure you could get it to work but who you place with who is up to the author, He after all knows what narrow mind heroism can do to you in the UWB and HF routes because of archer. there's a few point i think i forgot to cover but i'll see if i remember them in my next post.

@ghoohg

i thought that time loops were ban or disliked in general in this forum since i saw that they were shot down pretty quick.

@Master Basher

in your looping Shirou VS CED naruto most people here would want Shirou to win since there is no love and plenty of hate for that story here just check the Stories that you love... to hate, or just plain hate

they just hate it.

12/29/2011 #13
Lycodrake

@watcherinthevoid: Yeah, I thought that was all obvious, though? And if this were post-HF or post-UBW Shirou (I'd prefer using post-HF), he certainly would be able to call her out on her ideals and heroine schtick. Granted there is one guy in that story that *tried* to fight the system, but he was brainwashed ASAP to be just another sob.

And it's been heavily hinted that the Big Bad of Shitsurakuen is female. Yeah... T_T;

12/29/2011 #14
Master Basher

@Witv

on the Time Loops, I'd agree. Normally, the 'Peggy Sue' notion is hated. But in Innortal style case, slightly less. But at the same time, imagine after Shirou lives a life as a possible Heroic Servant, and through quite a few routes, he'd start to get sick of living in general, since he's already lived a bunch of 'lives' by then.

Now, on the TL!Shirou VS CED!Naruto, I said epic, and I'd state my reasons.

Also, I'd link to the most relevant post here: http://forum.fanfiction.net/topic/88086/51972703/3/ that proves that Angra Manyu won't magnify what's already there. :P

Second, I got a hint of this idea from an idea from spacebattles. forums.spacebattles.com/showthread.php?t=208919 , just with other versions of Loopers instead, like Assassin Shiki.

Finally, the resulting victory against such a ******* would be priceless, UBW's for the win.

12/29/2011 #15
watcherinthevoid

@Lycodrake

After consulting tv tropes (am not going for 100% perfect here ) the big bad was indeed a female and the whole game was a battle between to super intelligent people one female the other male their names Tsuki the big bad female and Karin the male not sure where he falls. The people who tried to fight the system seem to be more like woobies forced into it just to try to give the story more depth then it's black and white view of everything or that's how it seems to come off as to me. Also since Shirou has tracing so he doesn't even need weapons from the girls also the whole fact he can flip the rules off ( even though only 10% of the people know them, source WIKI )

@Master Basher

nice way of shortening my username. On topic that would be interesting to see and i get the feeling that AM may feel outclassed by CED naruto but i think it makes for a better idea then real story.

12/29/2011 #16
Lycodrake

@watcherinthevoid: I admit that I haven't looked any further into the story. I read some of the Wiki and TV Tropes articles, and the first 5-6 chapters of the manga...I can't unsee it...

12/29/2011 #17
Master Basher

@Witv,

on nickname, I had to. It was long-ish, and the lack of Caps/spacing made it a nightmare to type/shorten.

But if Angra Manyu actually empowered CED!Naruto... Ignoring potencial Bad Ends, it might end up enjoying it's rent... a little too much.

Other than that, the biggest advantage Looper Shirou has is all those replayed lives. Heck, he could have even had a life similer to FFD!Shirou at one point, not to mention all the swords he'd be able to collect for UBW's, and Reinforcing his own Magic Curcuits. That's all the tools he needs in order to stand a CHANCE against CED!Naruto, let alone his brainwashed clan of kitsunes.

I can even imagine Archer taking a holiday in this scenario and giving Gilgamesh his slot for that loop, so it might end up as all Servants+Shirou & Shinji(-Rin, Bazzart & Sakura due to CED's 'Harem'). Hell, if Alexander was there as Rider, and Shirou's UBW's & Gil's armory + Ea fight of him, then they'd have the highest chance of success, though it'd be pretty overkill.

And this is before we get too carried away with Einzbern intervention, MA/Church attack on him, and Shikis...

12/29/2011 #18
watcherinthevoid

@Lycodrake

Wow you made it further then i did i don't think i even made it to end of chapter three or was it four, yeah that story pressed my berserk buttons just in the right way.

@master basher

It starting to become pretty damn complicated and in the end i think it may just fall flat as a full fic as i said i think that story may just be best to stay as a entertaining idea rather then a full story due to everything that people want to happen in it. expectationsthe story.

12/29/2011 #19
Lycodrake

@watcherinthevoid: I wanted to stop after chapter one, but...yeah. Berserk buttons were jammed and smashed with it. *nods* XP

12/29/2011 #20
Master Basher

@Witv,

Yeah, sorry about that. That's just me getting too carried away with an idea.

Also, if this rather nice ideadoesget turned into a story by me, I'd avoid the VS CED!Naruto snippets for a long time. As in, after I cover the Fate, EMIYA and SHIKI loops, and lightly touch upon a few more like Notes. I'd only think of starting such a loop as one massive chapter, with a higher kill count than HF Route.

But 'til then, I have to cover my own interests, and finish some of my list of one shot ideas. *Looks at Rainbow Factory List*

-

@Lyco,

As for the fanfic itself, the most scary part is I kinda not noticed how bad it got until you look at a few chapters in, by which point, your either avoiding it for a good reason, or are hopelessly hooked until a hiatus kicks in to disillusion you. Though it does gives a question over which type of Fanon Naruto is more horrible, but that could be best left for another thread.

12/29/2011 . Edited 12/29/2011 #21
Silver Sun 17

Forgive mess ups

On ipod

What is CED Naruto

12/29/2011 #22
watcherinthevoid

@ Silver Sun 17

head to the Stories that you love... to hate, or just plain hate thread look though the first page and third to get a idea of why Master basher wants it to get killed in a most brutal method as possible.

Edit: oops forgot to mention what it stood for Chunin exam day

12/29/2011 . Edited 12/29/2011 #23
A Narcissist

Hey guys, I'm going to unlurk just to give my own two cents on the Shitsurakuen idea. Now I haven't really heard of this manga, and I only have a little bit of information on it based on my brief skim of the wikipedia page. However the thing that strikes me as the most obvious point of crossing and also serves as the greatest plot hook is the Exaclan game. Now Wikipedia says that this game takes place in a virtual world. Now here is my idea, What if after the events of Fate / Extra the protagonist; either male or female, Wakes up inside the world of the game? Preferably with their servant with them.

12/29/2011 #24
watcherinthevoid

@ A Narcissist

Remember everyone on this so far thread is working with guesswork and incomplete understanding of the manga since we rage quit while reading that manga

That not a bad idea however considering the condition[1] of the protagonist of fate/extra you could easily make a story out of it but you could also make a omake out of this idea but the VR in Shitsurakuen is only used in battle. There's a rumor that during the night near the Hospital/Harbor (which ever you want to chose) there's a tall dark skinned owner ( that seems to be what they call the participants) with snow white hair along with his possession ( we'll use the female protagonist ). So the heroine who ideal is to be a knight goes there thinking that the female protagonist is be abuse in order to save her from her abusive owner, and gets into a fight (read gets curb stomped ) since she's up ageist a servant and i doubt that she could match up even to a servant with E rank in all stats any way as archer is about to lop her head off since well that what happens in a holy grail battle the female protagonist call him off and soon after they fade away since what ever bug in the VR battle system fixes itself because of the fight since when the female protagonist won the VR that was keeping them there shut off leaving the heroine of Shitsurakuen very confused as to what the **** just happened

1 if i remember correctly the fate/extra protagonist is frozen somewhere however the HGW in the extra universe made a model of the protagonist but since she/he was still alive MAGIC happened and the copy in the HGW that was ment to be nothing more then a NPC regained sentience.

12/29/2011 #25
Lycodrake

@A Narcissist: Wait...it's virtual!? I read the first few chapters, the TV Tropes and Wikipedia article of the manga, and there was no hint of that...

And why the hell put the Fate/Extra protagonist in there!? Seriously? Either gender and any of the three possible Servants...just...how would that help or make things better? Really, explain it to me so I can understand how that would do anything. And I'm not talking power levels...

12/29/2011 #26
watcherinthevoid

@lycodrake

i think it said that the battle system was handle with VR outside of battle it was plain old real life.

12/29/2011 #27
Lycodrake

@watcherinthevoid: Yes, but the entire thing isn't VR...I have a hard time believing a crossover with F/E would work out...

I wouldn't mind Tainted Ideals Shirou and Assassin showing up...

12/29/2011 . Edited 12/29/2011 #28
A Narcissist

@Lycodrake

As I have explained, I haven't read the manga yet and only have knowledge based on what wikipedia says, and wikipedia says "Exaclan (エグザクラン Eguzakuran?) is a virtual game in which male players possess females, who contain weapons." so that's what I based most of my idea on. Since I only skimmed through the page I got the wrong idea. Sorry. I chose the fate extra protagonist because...well I just finished fate extra about a day ago and I also happen to enjoy his / her personality more than I do most type moon protagonists. As generic as it is.

@watcherinthevoid

Hmm, I really like that idea. I like it a lot actually. It would make for a great short story, thinking about 3 or 4 chapters long. Longer if you pad it out by explaining all the detective work. Hmm, what if...the reason why the protagonist only appears in those locations is because she is really some kind of a ghost?

12/29/2011 #29
Lycodrake

@A Narcissist: Fair enough, I guess. But "virtual" can mean different things, not necessarily "related to digital".

...I've read the manga, which I can not unsee, and I just don't see F/E working.

12/29/2011 #30
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