The Mechanics of In Flight
One of my reviewers mentioned the idea of starting a forum for those who want to debate various points of my story without clogging up the review section too much. I decided to go ahead and give it a try.
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Shioran Toushin

so lol, it has feedback? lol

@Chrnno: would you like to continue our debate here on PM or on the lore thread, because i'd like to argue semantics again jeje.

7/10/2012 #1,471
chrnno

Off course it is not perfect, the Amusphere(the next generation) has even more feedback since they downgraded everything to prevent any chance whatsoever of what happens in the VR affecting your real body...

Best to be in the lore thread, who knows someone might find it interesting and add to the discussion.

7/11/2012 #1,472
FanFicReader712012

Shiro Emiya meets Touma Kamijou

7/11/2012 #1,473
Shioran Toushin

TAMNI ain't an eroge, OTOH Touma gets beaten Hard (why? because while his ability is Hax, a normal being han kill him using normal weapons and or martial arts) OTOH he is a freaing seal.

but more to the point ad really relevant is ust how would they interact.

7/11/2012 #1,474
JamJackEvo

Probably along the lines of--

Shirou: So... how's your harem going for you?

Touma: Misfortune at every turn.

Shirou: ...

Touma: How exactly do you tame a tsundere like the one I have anyway?

Shirou: *shakes head with a dry smile* You don't. They tame you.

7/11/2012 #1,475
Shioran Toushin

... or so they want to think.

7/11/2012 #1,476
Truth Timeheart

Will someone write me a translation guide for all the acronmes Shiro T uses I am having trouble findind out what Shiro T is trying to say.

7/11/2012 #1,477
lhklan The Unpronounceable

@Truth:

TAMNI: To Aru Majutsu No INdex

OTOH: On the other hand...

@Fanfic

Shirou wins the fight. Outskirtbattledome already done it a few times.

7/11/2012 #1,478
UBW

@lhklan

ah I remember that

TAMNI fans were like Touma was going to break all of Shirou's projections (including Gae Bolg) and beat him up and stuff...

so Nasu fans told them Shirou doesn't even have to rely on his projections.

Shirou can beat the living crap out of Touma without magecraft period. XD

7/11/2012 #1,479
lhklan The Unpronounceable

@UBW

yeah, TAMNI fans tend to fanwank Touma like that.

Hell, just have Shirou swordrains Touma., 100 swords at once. Try to block them all.

7/11/2012 #1,480
UBW

@lhklan

unless Touma can Tsubame Gaeshi spam swing his right hand (meaning capable of multi-dimensional refraction phenomenon)... lol

well perhaps if he dedicated his life to just that alone like Assassin did puhahahaha... nah not even that will be enough :P

7/11/2012 #1,481
Recraptor0
From phone: Think I got solution for SAO before I fell asleep. And it won't even change cannon! Let him be a faker! He has his own unique fighting style right? Let all who witness it assume that it's one of those 10 specials and have Shirou misunderstand when people question him about it! Then people would realize that he's just a fake special skill user and forget about him... Ignoring the fact that he kills monsters through death via papercut faster than most people kill hem with skills. GAR meets inventory menu ftw! unload inventory to create his battlefield! H could be the inspiration for the original game protagonist to stop using programmer moves against Heathcliff (big bad I think)
7/11/2012 #1,482
Megaolix

I'm not sure of that. Shirou's style at this time needs him to dual wield, which he cannot ge...

...

Actually, I wonder if Shirou could steal the skill from Kirito or if it could be granted to him too if they're equal. After all, from the mouth of the creator itself: Out of the ten unique skills, ┬źDual Blades┬╗ is given to the player with the fastest reaction speed.

Shirou is certainly levelling slower than Kirito here, but his experience should still let him match Kirito's rising reaction speed as he get used more and more to battles. Maybe, if he attracts someone's interest (those who read the novel know who), he could wake up with the skill one morning?

7/12/2012 #1,483
Shioran Toushin

Shirou's reaction speed in canon is just short of insane, mainly because with his distortion he reacts insctinctively to many things, and even then his reaction time is short of insane, see when he encounters Rider, the GoB projectile rain and his multiple traces against a reinforced Souchirou (who now i see ain't top assassin, but his speed was 'servant' level.

but him being The Blacksmith or a faker would be cool too.

7/12/2012 #1,484
lhklan The Unpronounceable

The term "reaction speed" in SAO is rather vague to me. I'm not sure it's the speed that you can move at, or the speed that the brain send the signal to your organ.

In the end though, I think Shirou have the higher chance of getting "Dual Blade" than Kirito. Shirou's OBD profile said that his speed is at least peak human level at base while ramping up so supersonic and hypersonic with projections, which is very much higher than a normal highschool student like Kirigaya Kazuto.

7/12/2012 #1,485
Shioran Toushin

well IIRC Reaction time is the elapsed time between the presentation of a sensory stimulus and the subsequent behavioral response, in perceptual-motor tasks to infer the content, duration, and temporal sequencing of cognitive operations. It indicates how fast the thinker can execute the mental operations needed by the task at hand. In turn, speed of processing is considered an index of processing efficiency. The behavioral response is typically a button press but can also be an eye movement, a vocal response, or some other observable behavior.

7/12/2012 #1,486
Megaolix

And that isn't something only Shirou can be great at. Kirito has to be getting better and better the way he goes in SOA. And since Kirito sure didn't start with it right away, there's probably a requirement to have one-handed sword skill at a certain level.

Of course, I'm not agaisnt thinking of another skill. Perhaps something for mastering the blacksmith and one-handed sword skills? Since there's no magic, the only way projection will happens is if there's a hp cost tied to it, called ''Blood Sword' or something. The stronger the sword and the longer it lasts, the higher the cost. And it would fit since Shirou can't just spam swords unless he deploys UBW.

But without dual wield, I don't think Shirou could ever use this to maximum effect.

7/12/2012 #1,487
Shioran Toushin

no it's a mix between genetics, nature, talent, experience and hard won Skill.

Everyone can reduce their reaction time, to a certain level, the magi Reaction Time is even lower thanks to Reinforcement and experiments/enhancements and breeding (genetics and hybridations), Spirits and the like have even Lower RT because technically their bodies are made of energy.

but compare this:

Kirito, your average guy with a good RT who, by playing Video Games (wich are a good waty to reduce RT) and being trapped into SAO is reducing his RT.

with

Shirou, War Veteran, distorted, magus, used to be in Stressing situations in canon and fought dudes thar defied the laws of physics in the real world.

and that is the canon Shirou, this is a Shirou who didn't only inmediately react to the happenings of the Grai War, but hunted Apostles, fought against Hunters from the MA/CT (not enforcers or Executors because those are on a whole other level), Sekirei who also have a low RT, went to Monster Girl Ques world, Went to QB world, experienced Rance's World and is getting suck into SAO, wich reminds him too much of just every single encounter he has seen in his life.

also by this point he should have Eye of the Mind True, because that skill is based on freaking experience.

Shirou should have the lowest RT of all Players once he starts playing by the rules, because IIRC by this point, putting an analogy, is trying to use the Ryu skillset with Dalshim as his character.

by the way, Shirou and EMIYA CAN spam swords, heck EMIYA did it in UBW route and so did Shirou when countering the Low Fire Rate barrage from GoB OTOH they cannot sustain it for long (well, EMIYA could since he is a servant and when he is not that he is a CG) unlike Gil who can Swordspam indiscriminately because he only needs to open GoB.

Using UBW just makes it simpler and more massive at an absurdly huge prana cost (so reality doesn't stomp the RM)

7/12/2012 . Edited 7/12/2012 #1,488
Megaolix

First, I don't want to depower Kirito just for Shirou to get Dual Wield. I will not change my mind on this.

Second, about that part: 'used to be in Stressing situations in canon and fought dudes thar defied the laws of physics in the real world.' Do remember that SAO isn't the real world and Kirito, being a solo player, is getting into far more stressful situations than Shirou who is probably always with Yukari on the field. Second, considering Shirou isn't facing the kind of opponents he once did, I can't see him not losing his edge a bit on that. Over a short time? yeah, this wouldn't be enough for Kirito to reach Shirou's level. But considering how long the players are stuck in SOA.

...You know, I just had an idle idea. I wonder if Shirou is going to teach Yukari how to fight with a sword without skills.

Anyway, back on topic, that's why I suggested that Shirou should attract the attention of the 'God' of SOA. If he see the anomaly that Shirou is, he may just make some changes to see what will happen. And this method wouldn't need Kirito to be powered down.

7/12/2012 #1,489
Shioran Toushin

First

... Reaction Time is a Real Worl Skill, Shirou has years of experience above Kirito, you remember that he was brought to SAO from Rance, QB, MGQ, Sekirei, Nasu watrs and CT/MA.

i am talking to At this freaking point in the story, Shirou has lower RT than kirito who is still staring in SAO, and from

'used to be in Stressing situations in canon and fought dudes thar defied the laws of physics in the real world.'

he dealt with that, while Kirito was... being a normal common dude? Do remember that SAO isn't the real world

do remamber that Shirou dealt with those situations way before SAO, and Kirito is just starting (and even then Kirito has way lower RT than every other player, except Shirou, because if Kirito didn't then he wouldn't have Dual Blades)

we are talking about Reaction Time or Reaction Speed, so unless there exists lag in SAO then it involves just how fast their brains can act.

Second i am just stating that if Kirito did gain Dual Blades because he had the best Reaction Speed/Lowest Reaction Time of all players then Shirou has Kirito beaten on that (Reaction Time/Speed, not that he should get Dual Blades), afterall i wanted Faker, Magus, Sword, Body of Blades/Swords, Staor of blades7Bladestorm, Blademaster, Battle continuation, Crusader, Templar or Blacksmith as his US.

On Topic: well it seems that the 'God' of SAO (by the way why are you using SOA, i may be wrong, buth wasn't the Series named Sword Arts Online?) just became a 'person of interest' in Shirou's point of view, it's just a matter of thime before the 'God' becomes interested in him.

and IIRC, didn't the author said that Kirito would get Dual Blades anyway?

Edit: ah here it is:

Mu-sensei:

The thing about unlocking skills is in chapter 2... somewhere, hence Shirou throwing his sword (as he did on beta to unlock blade throwing.) As for the errors, well Yukari was complaining, and he only used a skill after he threw the blade (and I didn't knew about it, so it was just luck). -Dual Wielding- well, it would still go to Kirito, because Shirou will do something (very stupid, and Yuki will make his life hell for it) that will earn him another unique style. So when he sees Kirito with the ability he wanted he will throw a fit.

Reply 7/06 #1,384

7/12/2012 . Edited 7/12/2012 #1,490
chrnno

Hum... I don't really see Shirou ever using system assist for his blows so what would be the point of giving him Dual Wield?

7/12/2012 #1,491
Shioran Toushin

dunno, i was just pointing that Shirou should have a lower RT/higher RS than everyone else, and that Mu-Sensei declared that Kirito will still get Dual Wield, maybe he gets an anomalous US wich calculated the strenght/damage of his blows bypassing the system assist?

7/12/2012 . Edited 7/12/2012 #1,492
chrnno

Or maybe something like battle continuation... Shirou does tend to get into fights with bad odds.

7/12/2012 #1,493
Recraptor0

I have to side with Shirou on reaction time. In one route when he was training with Saber he got ot the point where he not only defended a supersonic attack but counterattacked. Maybee in real life if his body was adjusted to fit in again (something like no normal kid has taht much muscle?) then I could by that in real life, but in the game iwth just nerve signals? Shirou all the way.

But if this is the same one thats been in QB, Rance, etc... does the 4 spirits have any effect on him? Are we gonna get a scene of the hospital room Shirou is in with those 4 floating around poking him to get a responce? The poor, poor nurses...

Mwahahaha! I got it!

Unique Skill: Eroge Protagonist

The ability to seduce all female characters in the game...

It could be like fate/zero where the guys face seduces females as a passive! So many people will hate him! And once more monsters will be after him! And if they ever get him he's gonna have to figure out an answer as to how he know to please them... mwahahahah! Hey this isn't a general omake thread after all!

7/12/2012 #1,494
Mokofooja

Actually, there is one interesting advantage posed by Shirou's real-world-learned sword-fighting in SAO's sword arts system.

All defensive maneuvers in SAO such as parries, dodges and blocks have to be performed manually.

There is some system assistance for those defensive maneuvers based on the character stats gained from leveling (like faster dodges and parries if the person has extremely high AGI, or reduced impact if the person's VIT or STR are very high), but the player still has to learn the attack directions and react accordingly to defend first before system assistance kicks in. A person who does not or cannot react to attacks is as good as naked and defenseless, regardless of his equipment and stats.

And even with system assistance, the impact of stats and equipment, though still significant, can be rendered utterly useless with a well placed hit or a badly placed defense. Remember, SAO modifies damage rates based on the location of the hit in addition to equipment and stats, and actually discounts equipment if the hit lands on an exposed limb, so light scratches, though damaging, won't do as much as a full laceration, while a hit to an exposed head will always do more damage than to a head in a helmet, assuming the hit is the same in all other regards.

Which then leads to Shirou's advantage.

His offense might be sub-optimal if he doesn't use Sword Skills, and unless he's at par level and par equipment with other players, he will regularly face stat penalties that will be difficult to overcome on the attack.

However, on the defense, Shirou should be nigh invulnerable to harm from players and monsters at or below his level bracket. Since he actually knows how to block, parry, and dodge properly from real-life combat unlike his fellow players, he will almost always be in a position of maximized efficiency when it comes to defending, thus milking his system assisted defense for everything it's got while minimizing the impact of an enemy's superior stats, equipment and offensive system assistance.

Accordingly, then, Shirou would only be vulnerable to 1) his equipment failing him and breaking under the stress of his fights, due to his advantage in experience, fearlessness and willpower outpacing his tools, and 2) significantly overpowered or over-leveled opponents, where even a perfectly efficient defense does jack for the stat disparity.

TL;DR: Shirou's manual-only experience in fighting makes him the ultimate tank in SAO, regardless of how he builds his levels and equips.

7/12/2012 #1,495
ahorsewalksintoabar
I'm surprized no one has put forward that Shirou's unique skill might be Independant Action, completely freeing him of the limitations of the normal Skill combat and system assist and letting him attack/defend entirely by himself.
7/12/2012 #1,496
Megaolix

Keep in mind the game didn't have Unique skills tailored perfectly for Shirou. Whatever it will be, I can't see it break away that far from normal gameplay set in SAO.

Anyway Mu, any word on the matter? We're all dying to know what you have in mind for Shirou.

7/12/2012 #1,497
chrnno

I still think the most likely would be an advanced kind of battle healing. Can't see Shirou not getting involved in lots of fights he shouldn't while still helping out clear the game.

7/12/2012 #1,498
lhklan The Unpronounceable

One thing that bother me though, is that didn't Zelretch send Shirou away completely? AKA with his body, not just his mind.

So how the hell can he replace the Shirou of SAO world?

Another idea I have is that Shirou fall into the game itself.

7/12/2012 #1,499
Shioran Toushin

he merged with the other Shirou, because in MGW, Rance and QB there wasn't an Emiya Shirou in existance and in QB he was Emilya...

7/12/2012 #1,500
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